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There we go.
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And everyone's wondering
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why I'm walking around
with this video camera.
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There's Claudine,
one of our collection people.
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Filmin' this so my mom
can see where I work.
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This is collections department.
I don't think anybody's here though.
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I'm here, stupid.
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Well,
I was lookin' the other way.
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And then in here is Pammy,
and she is just a sweetheart.
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Oh, yeah.
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I was working
at the credit union
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in the federal building downtown.
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{\an8}Hi, Mr. Mog.
This is Amy at the credit union.
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{\an8}I was really excited
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{\an8}because I was getting ready
to close on my first house.
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So when I went to work that morning,
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I was chatting about it with my friends.
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- There's Claudette.
- Hi!
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And just running around,
talking to everybody, visiting.
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Not doing any work, you know.
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Hi, Mom.
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I really liked the people
that I worked with.
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There was a general sense of community
in the building.
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She's Mary.
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Hi, Mom and Dad.
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And my entire friend group was work.
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Those were my friends.
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I took it for granted.
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The agencies
in the federal building were
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Social Security, HUD, ATF, Secret Service,
and then you had a daycare.
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{\an8} Little Tony was six months old
at the time.
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And I was working as a judge's bailiff
at the county courthouse down the road.
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{\an8}I wanted to see and check on him
throughout the day.
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{\an8}So the daycare
in the Murrah building was close,
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so we decided to put him there.
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A big treat coming your way
on today's Oklahoma at Four.
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We're going to be taking you
into the fantasy world...
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{\an8}I was 30 years old.
I had worked at Channel 9 for nine days.
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{\an8}Driving to work that morning,
I was excited
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{\an8}because I was gonna be
the four o'clock anchor in the afternoon,
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and we were starting to lay
the groundwork out for this new show
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that was going to be starting
at Channel 9.
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I had a green jacket
and this big white shirt,
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and I thought,
"I'm gonna get my nice jewelry on,"
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and I wanted to look good.
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And I remember driving to work
just full of excitement.
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It was a beautiful day.
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Do we have any...
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{\an8}I was working
at the University of Oklahoma
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{\an8}as a third-year resident
in emergency medicine and trauma.
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By the time I got off at 7 in the morning,
I was half-dizzy, half-nauseated,
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and wanted to go to bed.
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A friend of mine called,
and he wanted to go to breakfast.
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In the four years I was at OU,
I'd never gone to breakfast,
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but I agreed to this one time.
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One of my coworkers, Robin,
who was seven months pregnant,
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came and sat down in the desk beside me.
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And the phone rang.
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The next thing I know,
I'm hearing this roaring in my head.
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April 19th was a special day.
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We had a fundraiser
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for the Special Olympics.
It was a golf tournament.
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Almost all of the heads
of law enforcement agencies were there.
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{\an8}We had just hit our first tee shots,
and all of a sudden, my pager goes off.
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And then, all the other agency heads,
their pagers started going off as well.
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We were told there's been
some type of a bombing
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at the federal building.
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We then proceeded back to Oklahoma City,
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but we never thought it would be
at the level that actually occurred.
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{\an8}I'm Tammy Payne, at TV 9 newsroom.
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{\an8}If you are anywhere downtown,
you probably heard it and felt it.
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{\an8}An explosion of some kind downtown.
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Here is a live picture from Ranger 9.
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Jesse is in Chopper 9.
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Jesse, tell us
what you're seeing from the air.
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Tammy,
you can see thick black smoke
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billowing from the federal court building
downtown.
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We can see glass blown out
of other downtown office buildings
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about five blocks away.
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{\an8} Tammy.
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Tammy.
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It looks like part of the building
has been blown away.
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We'll have to bank around
to the other side.
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It's the federal building,
we're being told.
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My mic is open, is that correct? If you...
Let's try to keep my mic open if we can,
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and I'll be able to talk with Jesse.
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If you are... As the chopper goes around
the side of the federal building...
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- Wow. Holy cow.
- Look at that shot.
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It is absolutely incredible.
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The side of the federal building
has been blown off. Jesse?
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About a third of the building
has been blown away.
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And you can see this smoke
and debris and fire on the ground.
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Downtown, on the ground.
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Uh, this is just devastating.
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And we are uncertain
what caused the explosion at this time.
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We were having breakfast,
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and then there was this explosion
that rocked us out of our table.
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I got up and I walked to the door,
and it was raining, like, paper.
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It was, like, snowing paper.
And there was debris everywhere.
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But it was surreal. Dead quiet.
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There was a car alarm
in the distance.
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Other than that,
you could hear the birds chirping.
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When the shockwave
propagated down the street,
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it sucked all the windows
out of the high-rise buildings.
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It just crushed all the cars flat.
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And I took off running
for the federal building.
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When the explosion happened,
we were in court, and you could feel it.
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The ceiling tiles came in.
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Windows shattered.
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- Let's go.
- Evacuate.
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People shouting, "Get out.
Evacuate. Get out."
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It was chaotic.
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I could hear people saying,
"What happened?"
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That was when I heard the policemen
tell someone else in the crowd
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the explosion happened
at the Murrah building.
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And I was like, "No,"
and I just remember, I started screaming.
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When I showed up, the parking lot
was completely engulfed in flames.
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The building had been cut in half,
so you could see into the building.
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People had come out,
and they were walking like zombies,
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and they'd walk as far as they could walk
and collapse.
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They were in shock.
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One young lady made it
all the way to the curb,
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and she was staring off into space.
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So I walked up and said, "Are you okay?"
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And she looked at me, and she goes,
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"I don't know. I don't know."
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She had no idea what had happened to her.
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Robin, on the scene.
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- Robin, are you with us?
- Yes, I am.
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{\an8}It's unbelievable.
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{\an8}The thing everyone here is saying,
"You would never believe
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{\an8}that this would happen in Oklahoma City."
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00:08:06,402 --> 00:08:09,946
As a reporter, and as a person,
as a human, this is my community.
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You're torn
in many different directions of
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how do you do your job,
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00:08:14,285 --> 00:08:16,661
and how are you hurting
for all these people?
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You've treated people. What were they
telling you, the people who were hurt?
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Just shock.
They were just totally in shock.
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I remember, not too far away
was a police officer, literally just
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overwhelmed.
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I think that's maybe
the best word for all of us.
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Just... overwhelmed.
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When you are involved in a major case,
you know it's gonna be total chaos.
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This is just ridiculous.
I mean, this... I can't believe this.
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First thing I did
was get control of the perimeter,
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00:08:51,822 --> 00:08:54,366
because you're trying to protect
a crime scene.
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How many times do I have to say it?
Back up!
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The streets were blocked off.
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I kept trying to get in. Could not get in
because they wouldn't let us through.
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00:09:03,918 --> 00:09:06,002
I remember screaming at a police officer,
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00:09:06,003 --> 00:09:10,883
and I said, "I have to get through.
I've got to get to my son."
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"He's at the daycare."
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And at that point, he said,
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"All the children are being taken
to the hospital."
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{\an8}Quite hectic here.
They're trying to keep it together.
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{\an8}We have not had
any reports of fatalities at this point.
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{\an8}Definitely, like I said,
plenty of injuries.
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Obviously, we wanted
to get a handle of all this,
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but in this case, the savings of lives
was paramount over anything else.
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It was going so fast.
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You'd have five, ten,
fifteen seconds to assess somebody.
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Okay, whenever you're ready,
we're ready to--
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So I'm looking for signs of life.
Any signs of life.
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Corneal reflexes,
respirations, heart rate, pulse.
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Anything that would give me an indication
that there's at least one sign of life.
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I would say
which ones were gonna go first,
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00:10:00,308 --> 00:10:02,435
and which ones could wait a few minutes.
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00:10:03,227 --> 00:10:04,728
This is one of the critical!
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00:10:04,729 --> 00:10:07,648
And then which ones were not gonna go.
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That's mass casualty triage right there.
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Can you tell me your name?
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And to compound all of that,
you had children.
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Can you tell me your name?
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Our babies...
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00:10:26,042 --> 00:10:28,001
I saw only one
of those children come out
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with any signs of life.
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And right behind her,
there was an older lady
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they'd brought out on a gurney,
and both are agonally breathing.
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00:10:37,511 --> 00:10:40,389
But the child had
catastrophic head injuries,
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so I tell 'em to wrap her up,
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move her over
into the temporary morgue we had,
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and somebody stay with the child
until she stopped breathing.
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A lot of people didn't take that well.
And they... cussed me.
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00:10:56,822 --> 00:10:59,241
They said,
"You gotta be fucking kidding me."
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And I said, "There's nothing to save.
I got a woman here."
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00:11:03,621 --> 00:11:07,082
"I've got two more coming out.
We've had way too many."
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00:11:10,711 --> 00:11:13,464
And when I stood up and turned around,
her mother was behind me.
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00:11:14,465 --> 00:11:16,842
She was lost. And...
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00:11:24,392 --> 00:11:26,852
She didn't go with her child.
She just waved.
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00:11:27,645 --> 00:11:28,603
She just like...
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00:11:28,604 --> 00:11:32,857
When we took her away,
she just waved... and walked off.
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00:12:01,637 --> 00:12:05,432
Oklahoma City headquarters
was dispatching one unit after another
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00:12:05,433 --> 00:12:06,599
to the downtown area.
196
00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:09,061
We knew something major was going on.
197
00:12:10,521 --> 00:12:12,522
{\an8}I got a radio call from my headquarters,
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00:12:12,523 --> 00:12:15,483
{\an8}telling me to remain
in my area on routine patrol.
199
00:12:20,614 --> 00:12:24,618
I was driving on the interstate,
coming up behind an old yellow Mercury.
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00:12:27,329 --> 00:12:31,082
I see that there was no license plate
on the rear bumper of this vehicle...
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00:12:32,168 --> 00:12:35,629
...so I hit the lights and siren
and pulled him over.
202
00:12:37,506 --> 00:12:40,049
And then I opened
my driver's door and yelled,
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00:12:40,050 --> 00:12:42,011
"Driver, step out of the vehicle."
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00:12:43,471 --> 00:12:45,264
He didn't get out immediately.
205
00:12:47,349 --> 00:12:49,935
I yelled again,
"Driver, exit your vehicle."
206
00:12:52,104 --> 00:12:54,565
And the driver's door
of his vehicle came open.
207
00:12:56,692 --> 00:12:58,985
He was a tall, slender guy.
208
00:12:58,986 --> 00:13:00,780
A military-style haircut.
209
00:13:01,614 --> 00:13:03,907
So I ask him,
"Do you have a driver's license?"
210
00:13:03,908 --> 00:13:06,075
And he went to his right rear pocket,
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00:13:06,076 --> 00:13:09,497
and I saw a bulge under his left arm
that looked like a weapon.
212
00:13:10,206 --> 00:13:13,208
I grabbed the outside of the jacket
where the bulge is,
213
00:13:13,209 --> 00:13:15,418
and at the same time
I'm pulling my weapon out,
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00:13:15,419 --> 00:13:17,128
and I stick it to the back of his head.
215
00:13:17,129 --> 00:13:20,298
And he said, "Well, my weapon is loaded."
216
00:13:20,299 --> 00:13:23,426
And I nudged him in the back of the head
with the barrel of my pistol,
217
00:13:23,427 --> 00:13:24,845
and I said, "So is mine."
218
00:13:26,222 --> 00:13:27,806
I searched him and handcuffed him,
219
00:13:27,807 --> 00:13:31,142
and I take his license,
and I call my dispatcher.
220
00:13:31,143 --> 00:13:34,980
I ask her to run a check
to see if Tim McVeigh was wanted.
221
00:13:38,818 --> 00:13:42,195
The car was not reported stolen.
He's not reported wanted.
222
00:13:42,196 --> 00:13:46,283
And I can't find a criminal record,
but he was carrying a loaded weapon,
223
00:13:46,951 --> 00:13:49,661
and that's why
he was taken into physical custody.
224
00:13:53,916 --> 00:13:55,000
I remember that day.
225
00:13:55,751 --> 00:13:58,587
{\an8}I was... glued to the TV.
226
00:13:59,713 --> 00:14:04,844
{\an8}And then, Charlie walks in with a guy
that's just like anybody else,
227
00:14:06,178 --> 00:14:07,679
on misdemeanor charges.
228
00:14:07,680 --> 00:14:09,264
The standard operating procedure
229
00:14:09,265 --> 00:14:11,599
for someone booked in
on traffic and misdemeanors
230
00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:14,227
is that they are released
early the next morning.
231
00:14:14,228 --> 00:14:16,272
I did his fingerprints.
232
00:14:16,772 --> 00:14:17,897
He was not sweaty.
233
00:14:17,898 --> 00:14:19,732
His palms didn't perspire.
234
00:14:19,733 --> 00:14:23,361
He was calm,
and he was watching TV with us.
235
00:14:23,362 --> 00:14:28,241
{\an8}Marsha Moritz and I were discussing
what we were seeing on the television,
236
00:14:28,242 --> 00:14:31,703
{\an8}and McVeigh had looked up
at the television a couple times,
237
00:14:31,704 --> 00:14:34,539
{\an8}but he never made any comment
about what he was seeing.
238
00:14:34,540 --> 00:14:37,500
Then, after that, I took his picture.
239
00:14:37,501 --> 00:14:41,045
{\an8} Workers are having to crawl
through the wreckage to try...
240
00:14:44,091 --> 00:14:45,675
{\an8} ...they're talking to victims...
241
00:14:59,899 --> 00:15:01,482
My body was numb...
242
00:15:02,651 --> 00:15:04,028
...and I couldn't move.
243
00:15:05,029 --> 00:15:07,031
I couldn't really feel much of anything.
244
00:15:09,617 --> 00:15:12,118
It was hot and dark.
245
00:15:12,119 --> 00:15:13,704
I couldn't see anything.
246
00:15:15,581 --> 00:15:18,082
When I would breathe in, it would burn.
247
00:15:20,169 --> 00:15:21,795
I thought maybe I was dead.
248
00:15:24,924 --> 00:15:27,675
But then I heard a siren
going off in the distance.
249
00:15:28,677 --> 00:15:31,096
I realized I was buried alive.
250
00:15:32,765 --> 00:15:36,477
I was screaming for help,
but I didn't hear anything.
251
00:15:38,103 --> 00:15:39,897
It was the most sickening...
252
00:15:41,857 --> 00:15:43,025
terrible feeling.
253
00:15:43,943 --> 00:15:44,944
It was just...
254
00:15:47,488 --> 00:15:49,572
I was alone.
255
00:15:54,244 --> 00:15:56,955
At this point,
communications are shot.
256
00:15:56,956 --> 00:15:59,374
Phone systems themselves
were non-operable.
257
00:15:59,375 --> 00:16:02,919
So we set up a command post,
258
00:16:02,920 --> 00:16:06,339
and I'm literally having to use runners
to send messages
259
00:16:06,340 --> 00:16:09,385
to the various law enforcement agencies
that are there.
260
00:16:10,010 --> 00:16:13,763
And we have to determine
the source of the explosion quickly.
261
00:16:13,764 --> 00:16:16,349
The cause of the explosion,
we've heard several reports.
262
00:16:16,350 --> 00:16:18,518
We've heard
it might be a gas main explosion.
263
00:16:18,519 --> 00:16:19,936
We're not sure what happened.
264
00:16:19,937 --> 00:16:23,648
The fire department is looking into
a gas main explosion.
265
00:16:23,649 --> 00:16:26,693
{\an8}If it wasn't a gas leak
or something in that order,
266
00:16:26,694 --> 00:16:30,780
{\an8}if it was a bombing,
it implies a level of sophistication.
267
00:16:30,781 --> 00:16:33,366
In conferring
with my bomb technicians,
268
00:16:33,367 --> 00:16:36,203
we had a large crater
right at the front of the building,
269
00:16:37,121 --> 00:16:38,204
which would indicate
270
00:16:38,205 --> 00:16:40,748
that that was the source
of the bomb itself.
271
00:16:42,251 --> 00:16:46,046
And the direction of the blast
going toward the building.
272
00:16:46,547 --> 00:16:49,716
All of that information together,
it was our belief
273
00:16:49,717 --> 00:16:51,593
that this in fact was a bomb.
274
00:16:52,720 --> 00:16:55,931
We'd never had a bomb like this
go off in the United States.
275
00:16:56,974 --> 00:17:01,352
{\an8}Now I'm faced with a situation
that is probably going to turn out to be
276
00:17:01,353 --> 00:17:04,230
the largest investigation
in the history of the FBI.
277
00:17:04,231 --> 00:17:05,607
Just move out!
278
00:17:07,526 --> 00:17:09,527
It is now clear
to the investigators
279
00:17:09,528 --> 00:17:12,155
that the enormous explosion
of the federal building...
280
00:17:12,156 --> 00:17:14,657
Still no firm numbers
on the hurt and missing,
281
00:17:14,658 --> 00:17:17,618
and still no suspects
or claims of responsibility...
282
00:17:17,619 --> 00:17:19,912
...responsible
for the bomb attack in Oklahoma.
283
00:17:19,913 --> 00:17:21,289
As Bill Neely reported...
284
00:17:21,290 --> 00:17:23,167
There are no reports...
285
00:17:24,501 --> 00:17:27,211
- ...Los Angeles...
- ...Iran suggested suspects...
286
00:17:27,212 --> 00:17:29,922
...criminal courts building,
a building that is always...
287
00:17:34,845 --> 00:17:38,639
The Oklahoma City bombing
was the biggest story in the world
288
00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:40,225
from the moment it happened.
289
00:17:40,934 --> 00:17:44,562
{\an8}It was a news story unlike anything
that any of us had ever covered,
290
00:17:44,563 --> 00:17:46,523
{\an8}because it was so big.
291
00:17:47,024 --> 00:17:50,944
And even before the FBI said
this was a terrorist attack,
292
00:17:51,612 --> 00:17:54,280
people started looking at this
and trying to figure out
293
00:17:54,281 --> 00:17:56,574
who in the hell
could possibly have done this thing.
294
00:17:56,575 --> 00:18:00,996
There were so many different, crazy tips
that were coming in very early on.
295
00:18:22,351 --> 00:18:24,310
There was an FBI bulletin
296
00:18:24,311 --> 00:18:30,066
saying they were looking for a brown SUV
with two Middle Easterners in it.
297
00:18:30,067 --> 00:18:32,527
Two suspects described
as Middle Eastern men,
298
00:18:32,528 --> 00:18:36,823
20 to 25 and 35 to 38 years old,
both with beards.
299
00:18:36,824 --> 00:18:39,325
All of a sudden,
we were all looking to see,
300
00:18:39,326 --> 00:18:41,452
was there a Middle Eastern connection?
301
00:18:41,453 --> 00:18:43,454
{\an8}According to a US government source,
302
00:18:43,455 --> 00:18:47,750
{\an8}told CBS News that it has
Middle East terrorism written all over it.
303
00:18:47,751 --> 00:18:52,505
Unofficially, the FBI is treating this
as a Middle-Eastern-related incident.
304
00:18:52,506 --> 00:18:54,924
A Muslim woman and a child.
305
00:18:54,925 --> 00:19:00,471
She ran by very fast, at a very high,
fast pace, with her daughter.
306
00:19:00,472 --> 00:19:02,765
And they were all dressed up,
and I thought that was odd.
307
00:19:02,766 --> 00:19:05,519
A lot of Middle Easterners
were in and out of there.
308
00:19:06,103 --> 00:19:07,520
What were they like?
309
00:19:07,521 --> 00:19:10,857
They look... I'm sorry,
but they all look alike to me.
310
00:19:10,858 --> 00:19:15,696
Can somebody find out,
is this the second anniversary of Waco?
311
00:19:16,196 --> 00:19:18,322
- Same day.
- Is it the same day it blew up?
312
00:19:18,323 --> 00:19:21,117
- That's why it's the 19th.
- Same day Waco happened.
313
00:19:21,118 --> 00:19:22,953
- Jesus.
- In '93.
314
00:19:24,621 --> 00:19:28,583
{\an8}One of our reporters came out,
and he pointed out it was April 19th,
315
00:19:28,584 --> 00:19:32,921
{\an8}and brought up the fact
that this could be domestic terrorism.
316
00:19:33,630 --> 00:19:36,425
{\an8}I don't know
that it is too soon now to rule out
317
00:19:37,551 --> 00:19:39,427
{\an8}this attack as being some sort of payback
318
00:19:39,428 --> 00:19:41,847
{\an8}for what happened
in Waco on this day two years ago.
319
00:19:48,645 --> 00:19:51,898
In 1993, there was a raid
on the Branch Davidians
320
00:19:51,899 --> 00:19:54,650
that were led by a guy named David Koresh
321
00:19:54,651 --> 00:19:59,990
who was amassing a very large arsenal
of illegal weapons in Waco.
322
00:20:00,949 --> 00:20:03,117
911, what's your emergency?
323
00:20:03,118 --> 00:20:05,953
75 men around our building,
they're shooting at us.
324
00:20:05,954 --> 00:20:08,623
Tell them there are children
and women in here and to call it off!
325
00:20:08,624 --> 00:20:14,670
It ended up in a shoot-out
and a 51-day siege where the FBI came in.
326
00:20:14,671 --> 00:20:17,006
Bob Ricks was one of the main agents
327
00:20:17,007 --> 00:20:21,302
that was leading what happened
during the Branch Davidian siege in Waco.
328
00:20:21,303 --> 00:20:24,513
We try to focus on, are you coming out?
329
00:20:24,514 --> 00:20:27,975
It's always,
"I'm waiting for a message from God."
330
00:20:27,976 --> 00:20:29,894
We knew from the beginning
331
00:20:29,895 --> 00:20:33,899
Waco was going to be
extremely difficult to resolve.
332
00:20:36,777 --> 00:20:41,489
On April 19th, they tried to force
the Davidians out with tear gas,
333
00:20:41,490 --> 00:20:46,953
and a fire erupted,
killing 76 people, including 22 kids.
334
00:20:49,831 --> 00:20:54,835
Waco was really the lowest point
in the modern history of the FBI,
335
00:20:54,836 --> 00:20:58,798
and it became a magnet
for all sorts of people
336
00:20:58,799 --> 00:21:02,635
who were worried about what the government
was going to do with their guns.
337
00:21:02,636 --> 00:21:05,096
That's a stinking concern
about them women and kids.
338
00:21:05,097 --> 00:21:06,931
Why did they go there to start with?
339
00:21:06,932 --> 00:21:10,977
Over a stinkin' gun,
that he has a right to have.
340
00:21:10,978 --> 00:21:14,397
All over the country,
they were having protest rallies.
341
00:21:14,398 --> 00:21:18,317
{\an8}Like the Committee of 1776,
at the Lincoln Memorial in Washington.
342
00:21:18,318 --> 00:21:22,029
If you pass illegal and unjust gun laws
343
00:21:22,030 --> 00:21:26,827
that ban our right to keep
and bear arms, God help you!
344
00:21:28,996 --> 00:21:31,747
{\an8}And you had people forming militias.
345
00:21:31,748 --> 00:21:35,419
ATF are the criminals, not me.
I'm a law-abiding citizen.
346
00:21:36,169 --> 00:21:38,796
I didn't murder 80-some people at Waco.
347
00:21:38,797 --> 00:21:43,301
{\an8} There were extreme right-wing groups
talking about reprisal,
348
00:21:43,302 --> 00:21:47,806
{\an8}that people have to fight back against
what the federal government has done.
349
00:21:48,515 --> 00:21:51,058
Before the bombing in Oklahoma City,
350
00:21:51,059 --> 00:21:53,352
I'd had a situation
with the attorney general
351
00:21:53,353 --> 00:21:54,980
when she visited out here.
352
00:21:55,480 --> 00:22:01,610
I said, "You may not understand it,
but Waco is still a big deal out here."
353
00:22:01,611 --> 00:22:05,156
And her response was, "I don't think
people care about Waco anymore."
354
00:22:06,533 --> 00:22:08,075
In fact, we'd been commanded
355
00:22:08,076 --> 00:22:11,121
to stand down
and not talk about Waco anymore.
356
00:22:11,788 --> 00:22:14,665
Seeing those images
the day of the bombing,
357
00:22:14,666 --> 00:22:18,169
immediately it hit me,
this has got to be about Waco.
358
00:22:18,170 --> 00:22:20,296
And it was just so jarring,
359
00:22:20,297 --> 00:22:23,383
I had to stop the car,
and I threw up in a ditch.
360
00:22:24,968 --> 00:22:28,430
My assistant says,
"Bob, today is April 19th."
361
00:22:29,556 --> 00:22:34,101
And, uh, that gave me...
kind of a rush of emotion came over me,
362
00:22:34,102 --> 00:22:37,146
and at that initial time,
363
00:22:37,147 --> 00:22:43,403
I believe more than likely
that this was related to Waco.
364
00:22:44,279 --> 00:22:47,698
{\an8}There are many people in this country,
numbering in the thousands,
365
00:22:47,699 --> 00:22:49,325
{\an8}who consider the terrorist...
366
00:22:49,326 --> 00:22:51,744
{\an8}I say the terrorist attack,
they regard it as such.
367
00:22:51,745 --> 00:22:54,538
{\an8}...the standoff in Waco
and the fire that resulted from it
368
00:22:54,539 --> 00:22:57,041
{\an8}as their shot heard around the world.
369
00:22:57,042 --> 00:22:59,919
{\an8}They consider themselves to be at war
with the government,
370
00:22:59,920 --> 00:23:02,046
{\an8}and they believe that was the first shot.
371
00:23:02,047 --> 00:23:04,465
{\an8}There was a very real fear
372
00:23:04,466 --> 00:23:08,010
that this was the opening salvo
of something much bigger.
373
00:23:12,474 --> 00:23:14,725
That morning,
I turned on the television,
374
00:23:14,726 --> 00:23:16,353
and I saw the plume of smoke.
375
00:23:17,145 --> 00:23:20,606
{\an8}I was an FBI agent
assigned to the Oklahoma City Division.
376
00:23:20,607 --> 00:23:24,110
{\an8}The A.P. Murrah Federal Building
housed a number of different agencies.
377
00:23:24,111 --> 00:23:25,695
I knew everybody there.
378
00:23:27,614 --> 00:23:30,074
When I saw the building,
I hustled out in my car,
379
00:23:30,075 --> 00:23:32,368
popped the red light up,
turned on the siren,
380
00:23:32,369 --> 00:23:34,287
and raced downtown to Oklahoma City.
381
00:23:34,955 --> 00:23:36,497
And I was flying.
382
00:23:36,498 --> 00:23:40,918
There's red lights going everywhere,
black smoke coming from cars,
383
00:23:40,919 --> 00:23:44,797
and then I come around a corner,
and I see the federal building.
384
00:23:51,054 --> 00:23:52,138
I could see it,
385
00:23:52,139 --> 00:23:55,559
but my brain wasn't really accepting
what I was seeing.
386
00:23:57,519 --> 00:24:00,938
And I went inside to find anybody
that had survived the bombing
387
00:24:00,939 --> 00:24:02,607
that was still in the building.
388
00:24:04,234 --> 00:24:05,484
But it's not uncommon
389
00:24:05,485 --> 00:24:09,364
that a person who will set off
an explosive device
390
00:24:09,990 --> 00:24:11,866
will have a secondary device planted,
391
00:24:11,867 --> 00:24:15,078
and that secondary device is an attack
on the responders.
392
00:24:16,663 --> 00:24:21,418
So there were people already looking
for any kind of a secondary device.
393
00:24:24,379 --> 00:24:26,005
{\an8} We're looking for evidence.
394
00:24:26,006 --> 00:24:28,674
{\an8}We're looking for explosives
that got kicked out,
395
00:24:28,675 --> 00:24:30,886
anything that's going to hurt people.
396
00:24:31,511 --> 00:24:34,181
The building was nine floors tall,
397
00:24:34,890 --> 00:24:38,392
where every floor was
concrete about yea thick,
398
00:24:38,393 --> 00:24:40,227
and it had rebar in the middle of it.
399
00:24:41,396 --> 00:24:45,150
And the floors pancaked
when they came down.
400
00:24:46,443 --> 00:24:50,279
The top floors hit the next floor
and the next floor, until they got down
401
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:53,991
to where they couldn't go nowhere else,
and that's what you've got to go through.
402
00:24:55,327 --> 00:24:58,371
The first thing we did
was looking for wounded,
403
00:24:59,331 --> 00:25:00,873
and there was doctors came down,
404
00:25:00,874 --> 00:25:03,668
and they did amputations
right there, in the building.
405
00:25:04,878 --> 00:25:07,963
When a surgeon crawled into the hole
to do the amputation,
406
00:25:07,964 --> 00:25:12,176
he handed his wallet back and said,
"If this collapses, give that to my wife."
407
00:25:14,137 --> 00:25:16,931
Inside the building,
it was very difficult to maneuver.
408
00:25:16,932 --> 00:25:19,767
Nobody knew
if the building was gonna remain standing.
409
00:25:21,728 --> 00:25:25,440
There was a nurse ran in
to see if she could help,
410
00:25:26,399 --> 00:25:29,485
and a piece of concrete
fell and hit her in the head,
411
00:25:29,486 --> 00:25:30,861
and it ended up killing her.
412
00:25:40,497 --> 00:25:42,665
There's bodies here.
We have a man here...
413
00:25:42,666 --> 00:25:44,292
I heard men's voices.
414
00:25:46,086 --> 00:25:48,170
I started screaming,
and he starts yelling,
415
00:25:48,171 --> 00:25:50,590
"Got a live one. We need backup."
416
00:25:51,424 --> 00:25:53,300
And he said, "We can't see you."
417
00:25:53,301 --> 00:25:56,262
"We have to follow the sound
of your voice. Keep talking to us."
418
00:25:58,139 --> 00:25:59,432
We have another one!
419
00:26:00,016 --> 00:26:00,934
That's good.
420
00:26:02,352 --> 00:26:03,687
Check the line to it.
421
00:26:13,321 --> 00:26:16,949
I could hear they were getting closer,
and my right hand was sticking out
422
00:26:16,950 --> 00:26:18,660
of the side of the rubble pile.
423
00:26:19,578 --> 00:26:23,164
And I had a sensation
that someone had brushed my hand.
424
00:26:23,665 --> 00:26:26,250
And I said, "I think
you just touched my hand."
425
00:26:26,251 --> 00:26:28,460
He said,
"What color shirt do you have on?"
426
00:26:28,461 --> 00:26:31,965
I said, "I don't know."
And he said, "Think! What color shirt?"
427
00:26:32,924 --> 00:26:34,133
I said, "Green."
428
00:26:34,134 --> 00:26:38,263
And then as soon as I said green,
I felt a hand grab my hand.
429
00:26:39,431 --> 00:26:42,600
I thought, "You know, this is it.
They're, one, two, three."
430
00:26:42,601 --> 00:26:44,811
They're getting ready
to pull me up and out.
431
00:26:55,030 --> 00:26:57,448
I'm walking around the building,
and then I looked up
432
00:26:57,449 --> 00:26:59,576
to the top of the debris pile,
433
00:27:00,994 --> 00:27:03,495
and that's when I saw the LAWS rocket box.
434
00:27:06,082 --> 00:27:08,959
The LAWS rocket is
a shoulder-fired rocket.
435
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:10,794
It shoots a big projectile.
436
00:27:10,795 --> 00:27:12,422
When it hits, it blows up.
437
00:27:13,048 --> 00:27:14,841
They take out tanks with them.
438
00:27:15,759 --> 00:27:17,468
And all of a sudden, I get notice
439
00:27:17,469 --> 00:27:20,304
that another bomb's been found
inside the Murrah building.
440
00:27:20,305 --> 00:27:21,722
This building was right in it,
441
00:27:21,723 --> 00:27:23,015
and my mom's in there.
442
00:27:23,016 --> 00:27:24,016
There's a bomb!
443
00:27:24,017 --> 00:27:25,435
Bomb! Let's go.
444
00:27:26,436 --> 00:27:28,271
Everybody move back, there's a bomb!
445
00:27:28,813 --> 00:27:31,023
There's another bomb! Oh my God!
446
00:27:31,024 --> 00:27:33,193
Stop.
447
00:27:40,367 --> 00:27:43,203
I heard a lot of commotion.
448
00:27:43,703 --> 00:27:45,704
The rubble started kind of shaking,
449
00:27:45,705 --> 00:27:49,541
and I could hear what sounded
like people running on top of me.
450
00:27:49,542 --> 00:27:51,543
- What's going on?
- Another bomb.
451
00:27:51,544 --> 00:27:54,213
They're ordering everybody out,
including the command.
452
00:27:54,214 --> 00:27:57,174
Everybody is just pouring out
of the building on a dead run.
453
00:28:04,140 --> 00:28:05,350
I refused to leave.
454
00:28:05,850 --> 00:28:09,478
I had a patrol point his gun at my leg,
"I'm gonna shoot you if you don't leave."
455
00:28:09,479 --> 00:28:10,813
"But I got these patients."
456
00:28:10,814 --> 00:28:15,151
And he was like, "I will effing shoot you
in the leg if you don't leave."
457
00:28:16,194 --> 00:28:17,152
So I left.
458
00:28:17,153 --> 00:28:19,947
{\an8} Much concern down there
about a secondary explosion.
459
00:28:19,948 --> 00:28:22,282
{\an8}They are evacuating
downtown Oklahoma City.
460
00:28:22,283 --> 00:28:24,660
{\an8}Medical professionals
running from the scene also.
461
00:28:24,661 --> 00:28:28,498
The men just started saying,
"There's another bomb."
462
00:28:30,583 --> 00:28:32,127
I realized what was happening.
463
00:28:34,003 --> 00:28:37,799
And I just started telling them my name,
and to tell my family I love them.
464
00:28:40,635 --> 00:28:42,929
They were leaving me buried alive.
465
00:28:47,684 --> 00:28:50,311
And I'd start thinking about my life, and...
466
00:28:52,856 --> 00:28:54,190
Relationships, and
467
00:28:55,483 --> 00:28:57,985
doing something with your life
to help others, and...
468
00:28:57,986 --> 00:28:59,946
I had never been a mom.
469
00:29:01,990 --> 00:29:04,617
And all of a sudden,
470
00:29:05,660 --> 00:29:07,036
it was just so clear.
471
00:29:08,121 --> 00:29:10,373
I didn't live a life true to myself.
472
00:29:11,666 --> 00:29:15,295
Now that I'm getting ready to die,
I'm thinking about it and realizing
473
00:29:16,212 --> 00:29:17,713
I don't want to live it this way.
474
00:29:17,714 --> 00:29:20,175
I want to live it differently.
But it's too late now.
475
00:29:24,929 --> 00:29:28,432
People, you need to go further back.
Get further back. Go further back.
476
00:29:28,433 --> 00:29:31,435
- Move it, idiot!
- I need you to go further back.
477
00:29:33,438 --> 00:29:36,733
So we walked up the ladders,
me and this trooper.
478
00:29:37,609 --> 00:29:42,113
Now I've got to get it down
from the 8th floor of debris
479
00:29:42,697 --> 00:29:46,701
back down this ladder quick
because I don't want it going off.
480
00:29:51,539 --> 00:29:55,584
I go over there, and on the business end
of this LAWS rocket,
481
00:29:55,585 --> 00:29:57,586
it indicated that it was live.
482
00:29:57,587 --> 00:29:59,671
So then we tied rope around it.
483
00:29:59,672 --> 00:30:01,673
We're carrying this box down.
484
00:30:05,595 --> 00:30:07,012
We did that.
485
00:30:07,013 --> 00:30:08,472
{\an8}Put it in the truck.
486
00:30:08,473 --> 00:30:13,394
{\an8}They took it to the county's bomb range,
and they set it on fire.
487
00:30:16,648 --> 00:30:18,273
It was not a real device.
488
00:30:18,274 --> 00:30:23,071
It was a fake that was gonna be used
in a customs sting operation.
489
00:30:24,322 --> 00:30:26,406
And that was extremely frustrating
490
00:30:26,407 --> 00:30:29,661
because it caused interference
in the rescue effort.
491
00:30:30,161 --> 00:30:33,122
And so then
I was able to let people go back in.
492
00:30:33,706 --> 00:30:36,583
{\an8}We also want to pass this along.
ATF agents have confirmed
493
00:30:36,584 --> 00:30:40,379
{\an8}that explosive device they found
and had people scattering for
494
00:30:40,380 --> 00:30:43,465
{\an8}was a training device
found in the ATF office,
495
00:30:43,466 --> 00:30:47,719
{\an8}which is one of their field offices
here in Oklahoma City in that building.
496
00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:49,596
There are still people inside.
497
00:30:49,597 --> 00:30:52,934
They're not sure at this point
whether some of them may be alive or not.
498
00:30:53,977 --> 00:30:56,812
I'm running down the street,
and I get down in this fire truck.
499
00:30:56,813 --> 00:31:00,649
I see Special Agent Matt Lotspeich,
and he clearly was upset.
500
00:31:00,650 --> 00:31:02,276
I say, "Matt, what's going on?"
501
00:31:02,277 --> 00:31:04,570
He said, "I left somebody alive
in the building."
502
00:31:04,571 --> 00:31:07,614
We just sort of turned,
looked to the building,
503
00:31:07,615 --> 00:31:09,241
and then we both started back.
504
00:31:15,623 --> 00:31:16,915
Where is she?
505
00:31:16,916 --> 00:31:19,251
The dust was just thick,
506
00:31:19,252 --> 00:31:22,005
and you could feel
the building still moving.
507
00:31:23,047 --> 00:31:24,299
And I'm thinking,
508
00:31:25,508 --> 00:31:28,302
"I wish I could tell my kids
one more time that I love them."
509
00:31:29,929 --> 00:31:31,347
Because at that point...
510
00:31:36,561 --> 00:31:39,021
...I wasn't sure
that we were going to come out of there.
511
00:31:44,110 --> 00:31:48,865
And then we got down
to where Amy was buried in this rubble.
512
00:31:49,365 --> 00:31:52,410
There was a slab of concrete
that was laying like this,
513
00:31:53,286 --> 00:31:55,330
and this was Amy right down here,
514
00:31:57,624 --> 00:31:58,833
buried in tons of rubble.
515
00:32:02,253 --> 00:32:06,215
So I hear the men's voices,
and one of them grabs my hand.
516
00:32:06,883 --> 00:32:07,717
I got her.
517
00:32:09,135 --> 00:32:11,386
She was able
to grab somebody's hand,
518
00:32:11,387 --> 00:32:12,930
and he was trying to work,
519
00:32:12,931 --> 00:32:18,186
so he put her hand on Matt's boot,
and she was hanging on to Matt's boot.
520
00:32:19,145 --> 00:32:20,979
This time, I'm not letting go.
521
00:32:23,566 --> 00:32:26,360
Matt and the firemen started
handing me debris
522
00:32:26,361 --> 00:32:28,905
to hand up to the police officers
that were with us.
523
00:32:30,406 --> 00:32:31,740
Then we started seeing her.
524
00:32:31,741 --> 00:32:34,786
It's just like, "How in the world
could she even be alive?"
525
00:32:37,038 --> 00:32:40,792
I was stuck,
and as they worked to uncover me,
526
00:32:41,292 --> 00:32:43,962
they told me
I was actually still in my chair,
527
00:32:44,462 --> 00:32:47,382
upside down,
buried under about ten feet of rubble.
528
00:32:51,219 --> 00:32:52,886
Then all of a sudden, they said,
529
00:32:52,887 --> 00:32:55,097
"We'll count to three.
This is probably gonna hurt."
530
00:33:00,103 --> 00:33:04,648
And they counted to three and they pulled,
and I came out from under the rubble.
531
00:33:06,150 --> 00:33:07,484
Yeah, everything hurt.
532
00:33:07,485 --> 00:33:09,362
Every nerve came alive, but...
533
00:33:10,238 --> 00:33:11,447
that didn't matter.
534
00:33:13,449 --> 00:33:15,827
They took me out of the back
of the federal building.
535
00:33:17,078 --> 00:33:19,288
I couldn't believe what I was seeing.
536
00:33:21,207 --> 00:33:23,542
I didn't know what my injuries were.
537
00:33:23,543 --> 00:33:27,630
I didn't know about my friends,
but I'll never forget...
538
00:33:29,507 --> 00:33:33,344
looking up at the sky
and taking those breaths of fresh air,
539
00:33:33,845 --> 00:33:36,764
and promising God
I would never live my life the same.
540
00:33:40,768 --> 00:33:43,270
There's still a lot of fear
in downtown Oklahoma City,
541
00:33:43,271 --> 00:33:46,023
as the authorities try
and figure out who did it
542
00:33:46,024 --> 00:33:47,941
and what could be left of what they did.
543
00:33:49,652 --> 00:33:53,071
Oftentimes, bombing cases
are extremely difficult
544
00:33:53,072 --> 00:33:54,948
because the evidence is destroyed.
545
00:33:56,617 --> 00:34:01,246
We have to do a search
over roughly a ten-square-block area,
546
00:34:01,247 --> 00:34:04,250
and gathering every piece
of evidence that we can.
547
00:34:05,376 --> 00:34:08,211
I was asked
who I would like to give assistance,
548
00:34:08,212 --> 00:34:12,299
{\an8}and I thought Danny Coulson
could be extremely helpful.
549
00:34:12,300 --> 00:34:14,676
{\an8}He was head of the hostage rescue team.
550
00:34:14,677 --> 00:34:18,431
{\an8}When I drove in, I went directly
to the command center to meet with Ricks.
551
00:34:18,931 --> 00:34:21,641
And he said, "Why don't you run
the evidence recovery,
552
00:34:21,642 --> 00:34:23,644
and I'll run the investigation?"
553
00:34:24,145 --> 00:34:28,065
We sent in the evidence response team,
and started to search the site.
554
00:34:28,066 --> 00:34:31,026
We had in the hundreds of people
working the scene,
555
00:34:31,027 --> 00:34:34,530
so we systematically
could carry out the investigation.
556
00:34:35,114 --> 00:34:38,700
{\an8}Law enforcement agencies believe
that it was a bomb, possibly a car bomb.
557
00:34:38,701 --> 00:34:39,910
{\an8}That hasn't been proven.
558
00:34:39,911 --> 00:34:42,496
{\an8}Forensics haven't made
a determination yet.
559
00:34:42,497 --> 00:34:44,664
We sifted through a lot of things.
560
00:34:44,665 --> 00:34:48,419
The key to it, though,
was the differential to the truck.
561
00:34:49,253 --> 00:34:51,088
The first key piece of evidence
562
00:34:51,089 --> 00:34:54,466
{\an8}was found a block away
from the federal building,
563
00:34:54,467 --> 00:34:57,844
{\an8}in front of an apartment complex
called the Regency Towers.
564
00:34:57,845 --> 00:34:59,179
A gentleman was outside.
565
00:34:59,180 --> 00:35:02,642
He heard this swirling noise,
almost like a helicopter,
566
00:35:03,351 --> 00:35:07,062
and all of a sudden,
this rear axle flies into a car.
567
00:35:07,063 --> 00:35:11,441
The FBI came to me
because I'd worked auto theft 16 years.
568
00:35:11,442 --> 00:35:16,738
And when I saw that axle housing
so far from the borough building,
569
00:35:16,739 --> 00:35:21,160
I knew it had to have come
from the truck that blew up the building.
570
00:35:22,203 --> 00:35:24,956
The explosion was of such intensity
571
00:35:25,456 --> 00:35:27,499
that it caused the rear axle
from the truck
572
00:35:27,500 --> 00:35:31,129
that was used to deliver the bomb
to blow out.
573
00:35:32,130 --> 00:35:34,256
All I could see
was the very last number,
574
00:35:34,257 --> 00:35:39,261
and I took a chem tool and a wire brush,
cleaned it down to the bare metal,
575
00:35:39,262 --> 00:35:41,556
and then got the number off the rear end.
576
00:35:42,181 --> 00:35:43,849
And that was a huge break.
577
00:35:43,850 --> 00:35:46,977
And I called
the National Auto Theft Bureau,
578
00:35:46,978 --> 00:35:51,941
and I told the lady, "I need you to build
this confidential number to a full VIN."
579
00:35:53,442 --> 00:35:55,945
She said,
"This is an active rental truck."
580
00:35:56,612 --> 00:36:00,323
That truck had been rented
two days before
581
00:36:00,324 --> 00:36:03,535
at Elliott's Body Shop,
in Junction City, Kansas.
582
00:36:03,536 --> 00:36:05,955
{\an8}
583
00:36:08,082 --> 00:36:11,459
{\an8} The day of the bombing, I was
in a one-person office in Salina, Kansas.
584
00:36:11,460 --> 00:36:13,879
{\an8}I thought my involvement
was going to be watching it on TV,
585
00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:16,214
{\an8}and be frustrated
that I couldn't do something about it.
586
00:36:16,215 --> 00:36:18,842
But in the afternoon,
about three o'clock, I got a call.
587
00:36:18,843 --> 00:36:21,970
They tell me the truck was rented out
in Junction City, Kansas.
588
00:36:21,971 --> 00:36:24,472
Get over there as fast as you can,
grab the documents,
589
00:36:24,473 --> 00:36:26,349
and get them back to the lab.
590
00:36:26,350 --> 00:36:29,436
And when I was reviewing
the rental documents
591
00:36:29,437 --> 00:36:31,146
from Elliott's Body Shop,
592
00:36:31,147 --> 00:36:33,857
I saw that the name
that was used by the renter
593
00:36:33,858 --> 00:36:34,942
{\an8}was Robert Kling.
594
00:36:37,570 --> 00:36:39,196
We started interviewing people
595
00:36:39,197 --> 00:36:40,947
from Elliott's Body Shop.
596
00:36:40,948 --> 00:36:43,659
I realized we have an opportunity
to get some sketches,
597
00:36:44,285 --> 00:36:46,411
and the bureau called me and said
598
00:36:46,412 --> 00:36:48,455
that they've got
a sketch artist on a plane,
599
00:36:48,456 --> 00:36:50,875
and that they should be there by morning.
600
00:36:56,589 --> 00:36:59,674
President Clinton has declared this
a federal emergency.
601
00:36:59,675 --> 00:37:01,134
There was a big debate
602
00:37:01,135 --> 00:37:04,429
over whether to release
the Ryder truck information.
603
00:37:04,430 --> 00:37:08,935
Ultimately, we decided
that would create thousands of leads,
604
00:37:09,644 --> 00:37:11,938
so we withheld that information.
605
00:37:12,521 --> 00:37:14,981
{\an8}We have at this time no assumptions
606
00:37:14,982 --> 00:37:19,362
{\an8}with regard to who caused
this particular bombing.
607
00:37:20,529 --> 00:37:25,284
{\an8}And we have had hundreds,
if not thousands, of leads
608
00:37:25,785 --> 00:37:29,788
{\an8}from individuals calling in
to reputed eyewitnesses.
609
00:37:29,789 --> 00:37:32,541
{\an8}Each one of those
is treated very seriously.
610
00:37:33,376 --> 00:37:37,671
{\an8}But at this point, we cannot speculate
with regard to who is responsible.
611
00:37:37,672 --> 00:37:39,965
{\an8}My intent was to give assurance
612
00:37:39,966 --> 00:37:42,593
to the American public
that this was gonna be solved.
613
00:37:49,016 --> 00:37:50,977
I ended up going to the church.
614
00:37:51,769 --> 00:37:55,022
It was set up as the emergency site
for everybody to go wait.
615
00:37:56,023 --> 00:37:57,483
All the families were there.
616
00:37:59,402 --> 00:38:01,611
Everybody that had somebody
in the building.
617
00:38:07,285 --> 00:38:09,245
I remember Tony coming in.
618
00:38:10,830 --> 00:38:11,956
And...
619
00:38:13,082 --> 00:38:15,542
all I could... all I remember is his face.
620
00:38:15,543 --> 00:38:17,877
And we couldn't even talk.
621
00:38:17,878 --> 00:38:19,379
We just held each other.
622
00:38:22,633 --> 00:38:24,259
By the time nightfall came,
623
00:38:24,260 --> 00:38:27,971
my job was to talk
to all these parents who were there,
624
00:38:27,972 --> 00:38:30,349
who didn't know
the fate of their loved one.
625
00:38:30,850 --> 00:38:32,726
Now we need to check in with Robin Marsh.
626
00:38:32,727 --> 00:38:34,394
She's with some family members
627
00:38:34,395 --> 00:38:38,482
who are one of, some of many,
who are waiting for news. Robin?
628
00:38:39,108 --> 00:38:41,443
{\an8}Yes. With us right now
are the Cooper family.
629
00:38:41,444 --> 00:38:43,778
{\an8}We've got a picture of little Antonio.
630
00:38:43,779 --> 00:38:45,448
{\an8}He is six months old.
631
00:38:46,490 --> 00:38:49,368
This is the baby
we're all praying for right now.
632
00:38:50,536 --> 00:38:54,289
{\an8}What we've heard
is that, possibly, a child,
633
00:38:54,290 --> 00:38:58,084
{\an8}a John Doe that has not been named,
could be the Cooper baby.
634
00:38:58,085 --> 00:39:01,212
{\an8}Mrs. Cooper, you work downtown.
Tell me about your morning.
635
00:39:01,213 --> 00:39:05,676
{\an8}Is that a routine to take baby Antonio
to the daycare center?
636
00:39:06,927 --> 00:39:09,846
{\an8}Yes, every day I drop him off, and...
637
00:39:09,847 --> 00:39:13,558
{\an8}I go see him every day at lunch,
and today I didn't get to go.
638
00:39:15,478 --> 00:39:18,064
And I remember that first night,
it got really cold.
639
00:39:18,564 --> 00:39:20,691
The temperatures dropped down.
640
00:39:22,735 --> 00:39:26,613
It started raining, and I'm just like,
"Lord, please don't let my baby
641
00:39:26,614 --> 00:39:29,658
be in that building, cold and hungry, and...
642
00:39:31,118 --> 00:39:32,369
and hurt."
643
00:39:32,370 --> 00:39:34,371
It was the worst night ever.
644
00:39:39,085 --> 00:39:42,587
{\an8}The last thing anyone needed down here,
we're now getting, and that is rain.
645
00:39:42,588 --> 00:39:45,840
{\an8}But you can see back behind me
sort of an eerie sight.
646
00:39:45,841 --> 00:39:47,717
Rescue efforts continue this evening,
647
00:39:47,718 --> 00:39:51,179
and while they are holding out hope
that they will find survivors,
648
00:39:51,180 --> 00:39:55,600
{\an8}one lady who had spent all day
helping pull victims out of the rubble
649
00:39:55,601 --> 00:39:59,312
{\an8}said she fears that the death toll will be
in the hundreds.
650
00:40:09,657 --> 00:40:12,784
There's a story with a happy ending
this morning in Oklahoma City.
651
00:40:12,785 --> 00:40:15,453
The story of Amy Petty,
trapped for five hours
652
00:40:15,454 --> 00:40:18,873
in the rubble of the Murrah building
before finally being rescued.
653
00:40:18,874 --> 00:40:20,917
This morning,
she's at Presbyterian Hospital
654
00:40:20,918 --> 00:40:22,252
in Oklahoma City.
655
00:40:22,253 --> 00:40:23,504
How are you feeling?
656
00:40:24,213 --> 00:40:26,756
{\an8}Sore, but very fortunate to be alive.
657
00:40:26,757 --> 00:40:29,260
{\an8} What are doctors telling you
about your condition?
658
00:40:30,052 --> 00:40:34,557
Um, I'm just gonna be sore,
and I have a large cut on my leg.
659
00:40:35,141 --> 00:40:36,183
But I'll be fine.
660
00:40:38,185 --> 00:40:43,982
The phone was ringing nonstop,
661
00:40:43,983 --> 00:40:46,651
with family members of my coworkers
662
00:40:46,652 --> 00:40:48,987
calling to ask if I had seen...
663
00:40:50,281 --> 00:40:53,659
...that person at work that day.
Did I see what they had on?
664
00:40:56,036 --> 00:40:57,872
And I don't remember.
665
00:41:00,833 --> 00:41:02,333
I hope that they find them.
666
00:41:02,334 --> 00:41:04,545
I hope they find them, and they're alive.
667
00:41:18,142 --> 00:41:20,269
April 19th was a terrible day,
668
00:41:21,061 --> 00:41:25,483
{\an8}and April 20th
was the moment where people...
669
00:41:27,234 --> 00:41:28,277
{\an8}came together.
670
00:41:30,488 --> 00:41:34,074
People were bringing food.
People were bringing all kinds of things.
671
00:41:34,575 --> 00:41:38,077
{\an8} You can see it by the sign.
People are lining up to help.
672
00:41:38,078 --> 00:41:40,121
{\an8} Even though
we have our differences,
673
00:41:40,122 --> 00:41:43,417
{\an8}at least we can come together
as one to help someone.
674
00:41:46,378 --> 00:41:50,715
You began to see
that for this one act
675
00:41:50,716 --> 00:41:52,801
of madness and terror,
676
00:41:53,636 --> 00:41:56,555
there were hundreds
and eventually thousands
677
00:41:57,056 --> 00:41:58,473
of acts of kindness.
678
00:41:58,474 --> 00:42:02,269
Of people reaching out
and trying to make it better.
679
00:42:03,521 --> 00:42:06,231
They set up a shopping center
inside our perimeter.
680
00:42:06,232 --> 00:42:08,191
If you didn't have boots,
they'd give you boots.
681
00:42:08,192 --> 00:42:11,319
If you wanted something to eat,
they had it. Would not take a nickel.
682
00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:14,155
{\an8}The people of Oklahoma were unbelievable.
683
00:42:14,156 --> 00:42:16,283
I think it's what kept everybody going.
684
00:42:24,833 --> 00:42:26,334
The sketch artist arrived
685
00:42:26,335 --> 00:42:28,545
{\an8}and started working
with the three witnesses
686
00:42:28,546 --> 00:42:29,921
{\an8}from Elliott's Body Shop.
687
00:42:34,093 --> 00:42:37,512
He was surprised
because the first witness was describing
688
00:42:37,513 --> 00:42:40,056
a white male that looks
like he'd been in the military.
689
00:42:40,057 --> 00:42:41,767
Not a Middle Eastern male.
690
00:42:43,352 --> 00:42:45,395
And it's seven o'clock.
691
00:42:45,396 --> 00:42:46,854
We had two sketches.
692
00:42:46,855 --> 00:42:49,190
John Doe one, and the other, John Doe two.
693
00:42:52,069 --> 00:42:57,907
And then I got teams of agents to go out
and do a canvas of the Junction City area,
694
00:42:57,908 --> 00:43:00,410
to see if there was any sightings
of these two people.
695
00:43:00,411 --> 00:43:02,412
Did you notice a Ryder truck,
or a large...
696
00:43:02,413 --> 00:43:03,746
We set up roadblocks.
697
00:43:03,747 --> 00:43:06,958
We interviewed everybody
that might have seen the Ryder truck
698
00:43:06,959 --> 00:43:10,128
or seen anybody suspicious
operating in that area.
699
00:43:13,424 --> 00:43:15,926
{\an8} That morning, I called
the court clerk's office.
700
00:43:17,386 --> 00:43:20,347
{\an8}I was trying to get Timothy McVeigh
in court that day.
701
00:43:21,223 --> 00:43:25,644
And they said, "We can't get him in today.
We're busy." So I said, "Okay."
702
00:43:27,187 --> 00:43:29,106
We kept Timothy McVeigh in another day.
703
00:43:31,025 --> 00:43:33,651
How are you doing?
We're conducting an investigation
704
00:43:33,652 --> 00:43:35,612
on the Oklahoma City bombing.
705
00:43:35,613 --> 00:43:39,365
{\an8}Agents took copies of the sketch
and went to restaurants,
706
00:43:39,366 --> 00:43:42,327
auto parts stores, or hotels.
707
00:43:42,328 --> 00:43:45,163
FBI agents
literally went door to door,
708
00:43:45,164 --> 00:43:48,666
asking, "Have you seen this?
Do you know these guys?"
709
00:43:48,667 --> 00:43:51,544
They covered a lot of businesses
in four hours.
710
00:43:51,545 --> 00:43:53,379
And then we got very lucky
711
00:43:53,380 --> 00:43:56,466
when one team went
into the Dreamland Hotel,
712
00:43:56,467 --> 00:43:58,761
and spoke to the owner, Lea McGowan.
713
00:43:59,386 --> 00:44:02,889
When he asked her, "Have you had anybody
in here recently with a Ryder truck?"
714
00:44:02,890 --> 00:44:05,058
She says, "As a matter of fact, I did."
715
00:44:05,059 --> 00:44:09,937
We show her the artist's conception
from Elliott's Body Shop,
716
00:44:09,938 --> 00:44:12,815
and she says,
"Yeah, that looks a lot like the person
717
00:44:12,816 --> 00:44:15,151
who was here that had the Ryder truck."
718
00:44:15,152 --> 00:44:18,072
It was the overall picture of Mr. McVeigh.
719
00:44:18,739 --> 00:44:21,574
And they looked at me,
and, "McVeigh?" like I'm lying.
720
00:44:21,575 --> 00:44:24,078
I'm not lying. He wrote down Mr. McVeigh.
721
00:44:24,703 --> 00:44:27,164
This is the first time
we heard the name Tim McVeigh.
722
00:44:28,374 --> 00:44:31,918
{\an8}I asked, "Has anybody done
an NCIC offline search?"
723
00:44:31,919 --> 00:44:35,672
NCIC is the database
for every arrest made in the country.
724
00:44:37,591 --> 00:44:42,178
In 1995, there were actual
computer tapes that would tell you
725
00:44:42,179 --> 00:44:44,681
if a person had been pulled over.
726
00:44:44,682 --> 00:44:48,018
It'll tell you where they got pulled over,
when they got pulled over.
727
00:44:48,852 --> 00:44:52,188
But if you want
something off that offline data,
728
00:44:52,189 --> 00:44:56,485
you have to ask the computer
to find this name.
729
00:44:58,612 --> 00:45:00,614
Then you load a tape, it searches it.
730
00:45:01,115 --> 00:45:03,450
Unload it, load another one,
it searches it.
731
00:45:04,243 --> 00:45:05,702
Like it was in slow motion.
732
00:45:08,330 --> 00:45:10,833
At the same time,
we check phone records.
733
00:45:11,834 --> 00:45:17,840
Any calls that have been made from room 25
at the Dreamland Motel, rented by McVeigh.
734
00:45:19,633 --> 00:45:23,928
On Saturday night,
he made a call to a local restaurant,
735
00:45:23,929 --> 00:45:28,684
where an order had been placed
by a Robert Kling.
736
00:45:29,685 --> 00:45:33,814
We know that Robert Kling is the name
that was used to rent the Ryder truck.
737
00:45:34,314 --> 00:45:38,276
So now we know that either Timothy McVeigh
is Robert Kling
738
00:45:38,277 --> 00:45:41,113
or is associated with a Robert Kling.
739
00:45:42,281 --> 00:45:47,327
We have zeroed in on at least one
of the conspirators of this bombing.
740
00:45:58,464 --> 00:46:00,883
{\an8}Investigators have identified a vehicle
741
00:46:01,550 --> 00:46:04,511
{\an8}that was used in connection
with yesterday's attack
742
00:46:05,179 --> 00:46:07,473
on the federal building
here in Oklahoma City.
743
00:46:08,849 --> 00:46:11,058
Further investigation has determined
744
00:46:11,059 --> 00:46:14,729
that two white males
were associated with this vehicle.
745
00:46:16,690 --> 00:46:19,651
Composite sketches of these two men
have been prepared.
746
00:46:20,736 --> 00:46:22,862
Anyone with information
about these two men
747
00:46:22,863 --> 00:46:26,116
should provide it immediately
to the nearest FBI office.
748
00:46:26,867 --> 00:46:29,286
It blew my mind
when we saw the sketches.
749
00:46:29,995 --> 00:46:31,788
{\an8}Looks like a couple of Bubbas!
750
00:46:31,789 --> 00:46:34,540
{\an8}It looks like some guys wanted
for a beer truck robbery.
751
00:46:34,541 --> 00:46:36,375
{\an8}This does not look like the guys
752
00:46:36,376 --> 00:46:39,754
you think have masterminded
this incredible explosion.
753
00:46:39,755 --> 00:46:42,715
And I think we wanted to think
someone else did it to us.
754
00:46:42,716 --> 00:46:45,593
And again, Mitch and Jenifer,
what a change this is,
755
00:46:45,594 --> 00:46:47,136
from when all of the spin,
756
00:46:47,137 --> 00:46:50,223
and the sense of the thing
seemed to be Islamic fundamentalists,
757
00:46:50,224 --> 00:46:54,602
and now, suddenly,
the focus of attention is back on Waco.
758
00:46:54,603 --> 00:46:57,146
The focus
is back on domestic terrorism
759
00:46:57,147 --> 00:46:58,981
as opposed to international terrorism.
760
00:46:58,982 --> 00:47:02,318
And you realize...
761
00:47:02,319 --> 00:47:05,197
Wow. But that's us.
762
00:47:13,914 --> 00:47:15,289
Sadness is still great,
763
00:47:15,290 --> 00:47:18,167
{\an8}and it is growing
by the hour here in Oklahoma City.
764
00:47:18,168 --> 00:47:21,337
{\an8}The anger is too. We hear it from people
who are calling our station.
765
00:47:21,338 --> 00:47:23,798
Let's look at the suspect
information we have,
766
00:47:23,799 --> 00:47:25,884
put out by the FBI yesterday afternoon.
767
00:47:26,385 --> 00:47:29,637
Firstly, the media unveiled
a white male, about 5'10".
768
00:48:03,547 --> 00:48:05,965
Get up the next morning,
come to the command post.
769
00:48:05,966 --> 00:48:09,136
Everybody's excited,
and I'm like, "What's going on?"
770
00:48:09,928 --> 00:48:12,013
Walt Lamar comes into my office
771
00:48:12,014 --> 00:48:14,140
and says,
"Boss, you're not gonna believe it."
772
00:48:14,141 --> 00:48:17,727
"Timothy McVeigh
was arrested in Perry, Oklahoma,
773
00:48:17,728 --> 00:48:20,021
about an hour after the bombing."
774
00:48:21,356 --> 00:48:24,817
Mid-morning, I receive
a telephone call from the FBI,
775
00:48:24,818 --> 00:48:27,738
and they want to know
if Tim McVeigh is still in jail.
776
00:48:28,447 --> 00:48:29,614
And so I said,
777
00:48:29,615 --> 00:48:32,199
{\an8}"McVeigh has already been taken
to the courtroom,
778
00:48:32,200 --> 00:48:35,454
{\an8}and is standing before the judge
as we speak."
779
00:48:36,330 --> 00:48:39,833
He was 35, 45 minutes away
from walking out the door.
780
00:48:41,418 --> 00:48:42,835
He is the linchpin
781
00:48:42,836 --> 00:48:45,671
that is gonna hold
this whole investigation together.
782
00:48:45,672 --> 00:48:48,090
I direct Danny to go up to Perry
783
00:48:48,091 --> 00:48:52,178
and to prepare for transportation
of McVeigh back to Oklahoma City.
784
00:48:52,179 --> 00:48:53,721
He said, "Danny, go get him."
785
00:48:59,895 --> 00:49:02,021
We start hearing
that there's an arrest,
786
00:49:02,022 --> 00:49:05,483
{\an8}and that someone is in Perry, Oklahoma,
at the Noble County Courthouse.
787
00:49:07,778 --> 00:49:11,322
So I get in the car with the photographer
and we go to Perry.
788
00:49:15,243 --> 00:49:18,788
{\an8}We have a special report from CBS,
a possibility of one arrest.
789
00:49:18,789 --> 00:49:20,873
{\an8}Let's see if we can go to that right now.
790
00:49:20,874 --> 00:49:25,836
{\an8}We're told that a suspect, a person
is under arrest in Perry, Oklahoma,
791
00:49:25,837 --> 00:49:28,589
{\an8}that meets the description
of one of the suspects,
792
00:49:28,590 --> 00:49:31,343
a composite picture of which
was released yesterday.
793
00:49:32,219 --> 00:49:34,720
{\an8}And then, simultaneous to Perry,
794
00:49:34,721 --> 00:49:37,724
{\an8}we found out
about a raid in Decker, Michigan.
795
00:49:38,934 --> 00:49:41,477
Because on his jail booking card,
796
00:49:41,478 --> 00:49:45,649
McVeigh used a Decker address
as his home address.
797
00:49:46,316 --> 00:49:48,442
And at the Dreamland Motel,
798
00:49:48,443 --> 00:49:52,489
Timothy McVeigh used
the same address in Michigan.
799
00:49:53,031 --> 00:49:57,160
So someone in that house
is directly connected to the bomb itself.
800
00:49:57,744 --> 00:50:00,663
That very quickly got out
to national media.
801
00:50:00,664 --> 00:50:04,125
{\an8} The authorities have located
a possible suspect in a house
802
00:50:04,126 --> 00:50:05,126
{\an8}in a rural area
803
00:50:05,127 --> 00:50:10,256
{\an8}and is surrounded by federal authorities,
local authorities, state authorities.
804
00:50:10,257 --> 00:50:13,384
{\an8} We've got televisions
all over the newsroom, and you look up,
805
00:50:13,385 --> 00:50:17,263
{\an8}and there are live shots
of a farmhouse in Decker, Michigan,
806
00:50:17,264 --> 00:50:19,348
{\an8}where a raid is going down.
807
00:50:19,349 --> 00:50:23,853
{\an8} We learn that that farmhouse
is owned by a James Nichols,
808
00:50:23,854 --> 00:50:27,440
{\an8}and he has a brother named Terry Nichols,
that also lives there.
809
00:50:27,441 --> 00:50:29,942
{\an8} This house
or the outbuilding behind it
810
00:50:29,943 --> 00:50:34,697
{\an8}may have either a Jerry Lynn Nichols,
a James Douglas Nichols, some brothers,
811
00:50:34,698 --> 00:50:37,491
{\an8}one, both of them,
or some family members of them.
812
00:50:37,492 --> 00:50:42,204
And they are two possible suspects
in this Oklahoma City bombing.
813
00:50:42,205 --> 00:50:44,832
That's the connection here,
you see, to Decker, Michigan.
814
00:50:44,833 --> 00:50:46,959
And we've learned,
too, the name of the man
815
00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:50,254
arrested in Perry, Oklahoma.
A Timothy McVeigh.
816
00:50:50,255 --> 00:50:53,841
That is the person that was arrested
today in Perry, Oklahoma.
817
00:50:53,842 --> 00:50:57,219
We surround the house,
and it gets all on national TV,
818
00:50:57,220 --> 00:51:00,556
{\an8}so it was extremely dangerous.
819
00:51:00,557 --> 00:51:03,350
{\an8} They're going into the house.
Walking into the house.
820
00:51:03,351 --> 00:51:06,146
{\an8}You can probably see it
even better than I can.
821
00:51:07,606 --> 00:51:09,857
{\an8}Looks like they're going into the house.
822
00:51:09,858 --> 00:51:15,071
{\an8}The FBI went into the house in Decker,
and they didn't find anybody.
823
00:51:19,785 --> 00:51:23,037
{\an8} Right now we want to go live
to Perry, Oklahoma, with Robin Marsh.
824
00:51:23,038 --> 00:51:24,121
{\an8}Robin.
825
00:51:24,122 --> 00:51:26,791
{\an8} In the meantime,
while we're there broadcasting live,
826
00:51:26,792 --> 00:51:29,543
more people come,
and I then look around me,
827
00:51:29,544 --> 00:51:31,420
and there's thousands of people there.
828
00:51:31,421 --> 00:51:34,131
And there are media
from all across the world
829
00:51:34,132 --> 00:51:35,883
in this small Oklahoma town.
830
00:51:35,884 --> 00:51:39,804
{\an8}And you're watching
some plainclothes officials coming in
831
00:51:39,805 --> 00:51:41,388
{\an8}to the Noble County Jail.
832
00:51:41,389 --> 00:51:43,974
{\an8}They were just driven up
by the Oklahoma Highway Patrol.
833
00:51:43,975 --> 00:51:46,227
{\an8}McVeigh was very close to getting out.
834
00:51:46,228 --> 00:51:47,812
{\an8}He was gonna get out of there.
835
00:51:47,813 --> 00:51:50,564
{\an8}But we were lucky to get there
before he was released.
836
00:51:50,565 --> 00:51:53,943
{\an8}If we had not found
Timothy McVeigh when we did,
837
00:51:53,944 --> 00:51:57,488
it would've been
an excruciating period of time
838
00:51:57,489 --> 00:51:58,948
for everybody involved.
839
00:52:00,117 --> 00:52:02,618
{\an8} I remember walking up the stairs,
840
00:52:02,619 --> 00:52:04,995
{\an8}and there was a gentleman there,
with a cowboy hat.
841
00:52:04,996 --> 00:52:07,289
{\an8}He walked up and said,
"You boys from the FBI?"
842
00:52:07,290 --> 00:52:08,457
I said, "Yes, sir."
843
00:52:08,458 --> 00:52:10,668
He said, "If you have trouble
with the evidence,
844
00:52:10,669 --> 00:52:13,255
{\an8}put that boy out the back gate,
we'll have him."
845
00:52:13,755 --> 00:52:16,675
{\an8}Tensions were high.
This crowd wanted to see him.
846
00:52:17,342 --> 00:52:20,178
They should let him loose out front,
let everybody have at him.
847
00:52:20,762 --> 00:52:23,055
{\an8} If they're guilty,
kill the son of a bitches.
848
00:52:23,056 --> 00:52:24,724
- Go tell the camera.
- Kill him.
849
00:52:25,433 --> 00:52:27,853
- Kill him.
- I think they should kill him too.
850
00:52:28,520 --> 00:52:32,940
I look up, there's a SWAT team
on the top of the Noble County Courthouse.
851
00:52:32,941 --> 00:52:36,319
I just kept thinking,
"They got to get this guy out."
852
00:52:37,112 --> 00:52:41,323
I was really concerned about a bad guy
trying to take him or kill him.
853
00:52:41,324 --> 00:52:43,784
I mean, if he's part of an organization,
854
00:52:43,785 --> 00:52:46,620
if I was running it,
the first thing I'd kill would be him.
855
00:52:46,621 --> 00:52:48,581
I don't want him spilling the beans.
856
00:52:50,208 --> 00:52:54,295
We just waited and waited.
The anticipation was getting very high.
857
00:52:56,464 --> 00:52:59,259
The first time I saw McVeigh,
he looked like the composite.
858
00:53:08,185 --> 00:53:10,311
It's my duty to protect McVeigh.
859
00:53:10,312 --> 00:53:13,480
I don't want to protect him,
but it's my job.
860
00:53:30,790 --> 00:53:31,708
Thank you.
861
00:54:10,956 --> 00:54:13,374
Mr. McVeigh just sped away,
862
00:54:13,375 --> 00:54:16,962
here from the Noble County Courthouse,
in small Perry, Oklahoma.
863
00:54:17,462 --> 00:54:20,839
He was brought here on a traffic charge
and a weapons charge,
864
00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:24,426
but the DA and the judge here
did not realize who this man was.
865
00:54:24,427 --> 00:54:28,013
{\an8}Due to other matters the judge and I had,
we had to wait until this morning.
866
00:54:28,014 --> 00:54:31,850
{\an8}We've said all day long, in most cases,
this guy would've bonded out yesterday.
867
00:54:31,851 --> 00:54:35,437
{\an8}- How do you feel about that now?
- Uh, God was watching us.
868
00:54:35,438 --> 00:54:37,690
{\an8}
869
00:54:37,691 --> 00:54:41,151
{\an8}At the same time,
the FBI did start collecting evidence.
870
00:54:41,152 --> 00:54:44,363
{\an8}It was at the home
of James Nichols and his brother, Terry.
871
00:54:44,364 --> 00:54:46,907
{\an8}The Nichols brothers
are very anti-government.
872
00:54:46,908 --> 00:54:49,660
{\an8}They don't believe
in our government system, our banks.
873
00:54:49,661 --> 00:54:52,330
{\an8}They're full of this government hatred.
874
00:54:52,914 --> 00:54:55,165
We learn a lot about Terry Nichols,
875
00:54:55,166 --> 00:54:59,211
who is one of Timothy McVeigh's
closest associates.
876
00:54:59,212 --> 00:55:01,297
The FBI found out really quickly
877
00:55:01,298 --> 00:55:04,550
that this guy named Tim McVeigh
had lived up there for a time,
878
00:55:04,551 --> 00:55:07,136
and had been an army buddy
with Terry Nichols.
879
00:55:07,137 --> 00:55:08,721
{\an8}
880
00:55:08,722 --> 00:55:10,347
{\an8} And we found a company photo
881
00:55:10,348 --> 00:55:14,269
{\an8}that had both Terry Nichols
and Tim McVeigh in that photograph.
882
00:55:14,894 --> 00:55:17,646
At that point,
I set every bit of my attention
883
00:55:17,647 --> 00:55:20,483
on trying to figure out
where Terry Nichols might be.
884
00:55:21,192 --> 00:55:26,156
We learned about a former wife
of Terry Nichols named Lana Padilla.
885
00:55:27,073 --> 00:55:30,744
Lana Padilla told us that Terry was living
in Herington, Kansas, now.
886
00:55:31,494 --> 00:55:33,787
Herington's only a short drive
down the road
887
00:55:33,788 --> 00:55:36,832
from where the Ryder truck was rented
in Junction City, Kansas,
888
00:55:36,833 --> 00:55:39,044
so we're really interested
in Terry Nichols now.
889
00:55:40,086 --> 00:55:42,212
So we set up on Terry Nichols' house
890
00:55:42,213 --> 00:55:44,007
with the instructions of,
891
00:55:44,591 --> 00:55:48,303
"Try not to get noticed,
but don't let him get away."
892
00:55:50,013 --> 00:55:51,638
The agents sat there a while,
893
00:55:51,639 --> 00:55:55,684
until they saw Terry Nichols
and his wife and child come out,
894
00:55:55,685 --> 00:55:58,146
and get in the truck
and start to drive off.
895
00:55:58,646 --> 00:55:59,898
As the agents follow,
896
00:56:00,398 --> 00:56:04,234
Terry Nichols turned around
and passed the street that he lived on,
897
00:56:04,235 --> 00:56:07,864
and headed down toward
the Herington Department of Public Safety.
898
00:56:09,199 --> 00:56:11,283
It looks like
he makes the surveillance,
899
00:56:11,284 --> 00:56:13,619
and he goes into
the local police department
900
00:56:13,620 --> 00:56:15,079
and turns himself in.
901
00:56:15,080 --> 00:56:19,625
{\an8}He has been tentatively identified
as Terry Nichols of Michigan.
902
00:56:19,626 --> 00:56:23,003
{\an8}He surrendered to local police,
we are told, in Herington, Kansas.
903
00:56:39,604 --> 00:56:41,897
McVeigh was with me
in the backseat.
904
00:56:41,898 --> 00:56:43,857
He starts to get up and I sat him down,
905
00:56:43,858 --> 00:56:47,487
and I said, "You will behave on this trip,
or I'll hurt you."
906
00:56:48,238 --> 00:56:51,074
"Be a gentleman, and we'll be
a gentleman." He said, "Yes, sir."
907
00:56:52,492 --> 00:56:55,994
So I handcuffed him to the floor
in the center of the helicopter
908
00:56:55,995 --> 00:56:59,081
because I didn't want him
bailing out and killing himself.
909
00:56:59,082 --> 00:57:02,043
We want this guy alive.
We don't want him dead.
910
00:57:02,919 --> 00:57:05,088
But we don't know exactly
what we have here.
911
00:57:05,588 --> 00:57:07,798
This is one guy. This is a guy.
912
00:57:07,799 --> 00:57:11,468
Is he part of a bigger conspiracy,
and there's people trying to kill him?
913
00:57:11,469 --> 00:57:15,556
We didn't know.
So I got on the intercom with the pilot.
914
00:57:16,850 --> 00:57:20,394
I said, "Put this thing on the deck.
I don't want a LAW rocket up my ass."
915
00:57:20,395 --> 00:57:21,354
And he went...
916
00:57:22,188 --> 00:57:26,734
We literally jumped over fences.
We were that low on the deck.
917
00:57:27,235 --> 00:57:29,194
And McVeigh never blinked.
918
00:57:29,195 --> 00:57:30,321
He sat just like...
919
00:57:31,281 --> 00:57:33,158
Didn't look left. Didn't look right.
920
00:57:33,658 --> 00:57:35,576
Stone cold.
921
00:57:44,377 --> 00:57:47,213
Bob Ricks arranged for us
to take him to Tinker Air Force Base.
922
00:57:47,797 --> 00:57:50,508
Plus, he sent an FBI SWAT team
for security.
923
00:58:00,059 --> 00:58:03,813
Tonight, the arrest of one American,
another American being questioned.
924
00:58:06,149 --> 00:58:08,192
In the police department
there in Herington,
925
00:58:08,193 --> 00:58:11,236
{\an8}they interview Terry Nichols
for ten hours.
926
00:58:12,780 --> 00:58:14,365
We start talking to him.
927
00:58:14,991 --> 00:58:17,577
He did not seem flustered.
He did not seem nervous.
928
00:58:19,996 --> 00:58:22,164
He was cold and calm.
929
00:58:23,291 --> 00:58:26,627
We kept going back over
them going to gun shows,
930
00:58:26,628 --> 00:58:28,962
and them talking about building bombs.
931
00:58:28,963 --> 00:58:31,215
It was the longest interview
I'd ever done.
932
00:58:31,216 --> 00:58:33,927
We were able to hit him
with some pretty hard stuff.
933
00:58:35,011 --> 00:58:39,015
I said, "Do you think there's any chance
that McVeigh could've done this?"
934
00:58:40,350 --> 00:58:42,227
And his response was,
935
00:58:42,727 --> 00:58:44,979
"He could've done it
without me knowing about it."
936
00:58:45,563 --> 00:58:47,356
But then, Terry made the statement,
937
00:58:47,357 --> 00:58:51,110
"I know as much as Tim McVeigh does
about how to make bombs."
938
00:58:52,403 --> 00:58:55,989
We never did get him to say
"I did it" or "We did it,"
939
00:58:55,990 --> 00:58:59,160
but when I heard those two things,
as far as I'm concerned,
940
00:58:59,911 --> 00:59:01,245
that's what I needed.
941
00:59:04,040 --> 00:59:05,457
Now there is no doubt
942
00:59:05,458 --> 00:59:09,879
that if we put this guy before a jury,
they would find him guilty.
943
00:59:19,264 --> 00:59:22,140
First, we'll take a look
at the news headlines this morning.
944
00:59:22,141 --> 00:59:25,852
Federal agents are moving forward
in their investigation of the bombing.
945
00:59:25,853 --> 00:59:27,688
Some would say with amazing speed.
946
00:59:27,689 --> 00:59:30,399
{\an8}One man has now been charged,
others are being questioned.
947
00:59:30,400 --> 00:59:32,651
{\an8}There is a hint of more arrests to come.
948
00:59:34,279 --> 00:59:39,576
While Terry has turned himself in,
the FBI agents are searching his home.
949
00:59:40,076 --> 00:59:42,619
The question became, is he the only one?
950
00:59:42,620 --> 00:59:46,790
Is he a part of a group?
And is this going to happen again?
951
00:59:50,253 --> 00:59:52,379
They didn't know
if there might be tripwires
952
00:59:52,380 --> 00:59:54,590
or anything
that might set off an explosion.
953
01:00:01,472 --> 01:00:04,558
So the search warrant teams were using
an abundance of caution
954
01:00:04,559 --> 01:00:06,977
before they finally started
executing the search.
955
01:00:06,978 --> 01:00:10,063
Come over here.
956
01:00:14,277 --> 01:00:17,196
We find a trove of evidence
inside that house.
957
01:00:17,780 --> 01:00:20,490
We found five rolls of primer det,
blasting caps.
958
01:00:20,491 --> 01:00:22,409
{\an8}We found a calling card,
959
01:00:22,410 --> 01:00:25,455
and a receipt for 2,000 pounds
of ammonium nitrate.
960
01:00:26,247 --> 01:00:30,125
After the bombing, Nichols was trying
to get rid of this stuff.
961
01:00:30,126 --> 01:00:34,129
And he was throwing so much
ammonium nitrate fertilizer in his yard,
962
01:00:34,130 --> 01:00:36,256
the neighbors said
it looked like it was snowing.
963
01:00:36,257 --> 01:00:40,093
Now we're starting to put together
a good case against Terry Nichols
964
01:00:40,094 --> 01:00:41,262
as well as Tim McVeigh.
965
01:00:41,763 --> 01:00:44,848
But we knew, in a case like this,
we needed an insider.
966
01:00:50,063 --> 01:00:53,357
I call the division in Buffalo,
that's where McVeigh was from,
967
01:00:53,358 --> 01:00:55,360
and I had them get his father.
968
01:00:56,778 --> 01:00:59,738
{\an8}And I'm feeling a lot of sympathy for him.
969
01:00:59,739 --> 01:01:01,407
{\an8}I mean, if this had been my son,
970
01:01:01,908 --> 01:01:04,410
I couldn't have stood that.
That would've been horrible.
971
01:01:06,204 --> 01:01:10,040
So I ask him, I said,
"Who would your son do this with?"
972
01:01:11,209 --> 01:01:13,920
He said, "Terry Nichols
and Michael Fortier."
973
01:01:15,171 --> 01:01:16,004
Bingo.
974
01:01:17,298 --> 01:01:19,299
Michael Fortier, Terry Nichols,
975
01:01:19,300 --> 01:01:22,594
and Tim McVeigh served in the military
at the same time,
976
01:01:22,595 --> 01:01:25,180
and they were like three peas in a pod.
977
01:01:25,181 --> 01:01:29,602
They were very close to each other,
shared anti-government beliefs.
978
01:01:30,103 --> 01:01:32,521
And he's now living in Arizona.
979
01:01:32,522 --> 01:01:35,607
Bob Ricks, he said,
"We need to approach Michael Fortier."
980
01:01:35,608 --> 01:01:36,650
"I want you to do it."
981
01:01:36,651 --> 01:01:39,570
{\an8}
982
01:01:44,283 --> 01:01:47,912
{\an8}We arranged with the sheriff
to have him brought in to talk to me.
983
01:01:49,455 --> 01:01:51,207
And he looked like a rat.
984
01:01:53,418 --> 01:01:56,420
We said, "We want to talk to you
about the bombing in Oklahoma."
985
01:01:56,421 --> 01:01:57,671
And he got indignant.
986
01:01:57,672 --> 01:02:01,842
I do not believe
that Tim blew up any building in Oklahoma.
987
01:02:01,843 --> 01:02:04,761
McVeigh lived in Kingman
off and on the past year.
988
01:02:04,762 --> 01:02:06,805
Fortier helped him find a job.
989
01:02:06,806 --> 01:02:08,056
I don't want to talk.
990
01:02:08,057 --> 01:02:11,268
Kingman resident Mike Fortier,
army buddy of McVeigh,
991
01:02:11,269 --> 01:02:14,146
some sources say,
potentially a major witness in the case,
992
01:02:14,147 --> 01:02:16,314
{\an8}his trailer raided by the FBI.
993
01:02:16,315 --> 01:02:18,692
His life in recent weeks
turned upside down
994
01:02:18,693 --> 01:02:20,695
by federal agents and the media.
995
01:02:21,195 --> 01:02:24,072
The problem was
that we didn't have enough information
996
01:02:24,073 --> 01:02:25,700
to charge Michael Fortier.
997
01:02:31,998 --> 01:02:35,417
The most important thing
that we found at Terry Nichols' house
998
01:02:35,418 --> 01:02:38,880
that really tied Michael Fortier
to the bombing was the calling card.
999
01:02:39,464 --> 01:02:42,883
You have to go back in time
because we all didn't have cell phones,
1000
01:02:42,884 --> 01:02:45,886
but you could get a calling card
that was prepaid,
1001
01:02:45,887 --> 01:02:48,639
and every so often,
you'd have to replenish those funds.
1002
01:02:49,182 --> 01:02:50,432
They got that calling card
1003
01:02:50,433 --> 01:02:52,809
'cause they thought
that'd hide their identity.
1004
01:02:52,810 --> 01:02:55,271
We used that calling card as a roadmap.
1005
01:02:56,147 --> 01:02:59,357
This calling card was the key piece
1006
01:02:59,358 --> 01:03:03,779
that allowed the FBI
to map the entire spider web.
1007
01:03:03,780 --> 01:03:07,324
But it led them to places that they
wouldn't have known about otherwise.
1008
01:03:09,660 --> 01:03:13,163
And now we can go back
to trace where they were
1009
01:03:13,164 --> 01:03:15,373
whenever they'd travel around the country,
1010
01:03:15,374 --> 01:03:17,876
when they were purchasing
components for the bombing.
1011
01:03:20,379 --> 01:03:22,506
The other thing this calling card told us
1012
01:03:22,507 --> 01:03:25,926
was that instead of this big,
broad conspiracy
1013
01:03:25,927 --> 01:03:27,762
that we suspected initially,
1014
01:03:28,554 --> 01:03:31,432
it was limited
to just a small group of people.
1015
01:03:32,391 --> 01:03:36,521
But we needed to gather evidence
that's sufficient for a prosecution.
1016
01:03:37,021 --> 01:03:40,148
You have an insider telling
what happened. It goes a long ways,
1017
01:03:40,149 --> 01:03:43,945
especially if you corroborate
everything they're telling you.
1018
01:03:44,570 --> 01:03:48,031
We had a lot of arguments about that,
but we all came to the conclusion.
1019
01:03:48,032 --> 01:03:50,618
Sometimes you have to make a deal
with the devil.
1020
01:03:51,244 --> 01:03:53,788
I remember he said,
"You don't understand. We're at war."
1021
01:03:54,288 --> 01:03:56,832
I said, "No, we're not.
I'd have killed you already."
1022
01:03:56,833 --> 01:04:00,001
He said, "It's about the Constitution."
I said, "It is."
1023
01:04:00,002 --> 01:04:02,420
"We're gonna arrest you
under the Constitution."
1024
01:04:02,421 --> 01:04:04,881
"I'm gonna convict you
under the Constitution."
1025
01:04:04,882 --> 01:04:05,799
"And one day,
1026
01:04:05,800 --> 01:04:09,219
we're gonna strap you to a gurney,
stick a needle in your arm,
1027
01:04:09,220 --> 01:04:12,306
and we're going to execute you
under the Constitution."
1028
01:04:13,140 --> 01:04:16,727
And while we all can't stomach
the deal with Michael Fortier,
1029
01:04:17,436 --> 01:04:18,937
we knew it needed to be made.
1030
01:04:18,938 --> 01:04:20,939
He gave us a lot of information.
1031
01:04:20,940 --> 01:04:23,817
That may've been
the biggest break in the whole case.
1032
01:04:23,818 --> 01:04:26,904
He talked about meeting
with McVeigh in his kitchen,
1033
01:04:27,989 --> 01:04:31,116
and how McVeigh talked about
how he was going to construct the bomb.
1034
01:04:31,117 --> 01:04:32,784
And he used soup cans
1035
01:04:32,785 --> 01:04:36,664
to show how McVeigh was gonna try
to make a shaped charge.
1036
01:04:37,164 --> 01:04:41,293
After Terry Nichols and Tim McVeigh
had acquired the bomb components,
1037
01:04:41,294 --> 01:04:44,547
they showed Michael Fortier
the bomb components.
1038
01:04:46,549 --> 01:04:50,260
Tim McVeigh convinces him
to take a trip to Oklahoma City,
1039
01:04:50,261 --> 01:04:53,388
and he shows him
where the bombing is going to take place.
1040
01:04:53,389 --> 01:04:57,268
After that occurred, I think
Michael Fortier realized, this is real.
1041
01:04:57,852 --> 01:05:01,021
He absolutely knew
what Tim McVeigh was going to do.
1042
01:05:01,022 --> 01:05:04,775
He could've stopped all of this
with an anonymous phone call.
1043
01:05:05,443 --> 01:05:07,736
Charged with having
prior knowledge of the bombing,
1044
01:05:07,737 --> 01:05:10,655
he will testify
against McVeigh and Nichols
1045
01:05:10,656 --> 01:05:12,657
in hopes of getting a lighter sentence.
1046
01:05:23,419 --> 01:05:27,130
It was tough for all of us,
and we realized that there's a possibility
1047
01:05:27,131 --> 01:05:29,341
{\an8}of three infants
still being in that building.
1048
01:05:29,342 --> 01:05:33,595
{\an8}We're zeroing in on now an area possibly
where those infants will be found.
1049
01:05:42,146 --> 01:05:43,772
I remember the day they announced
1050
01:05:43,773 --> 01:05:47,777
that they were able to get to the area
where the babies' bodies were.
1051
01:05:48,569 --> 01:05:53,157
We were so overjoyed
that they were just able to find him.
1052
01:05:53,866 --> 01:05:56,034
Not that he was alive, but they found him.
1053
01:05:56,035 --> 01:05:58,536
That was what it turned into,
1054
01:05:58,537 --> 01:06:01,666
you know, just,
"Please just let him all be there."
1055
01:06:09,215 --> 01:06:11,801
After that, at night,
1056
01:06:12,468 --> 01:06:16,180
I would drive down
to the prison where he was.
1057
01:06:17,056 --> 01:06:18,933
Just sit out there.
1058
01:06:27,858 --> 01:06:29,694
Just sit out there in the dark,
1059
01:06:30,903 --> 01:06:34,240
wondering how I could get in
so I could hurt him.
1060
01:06:40,413 --> 01:06:43,665
The arrest of Tim McVeigh was the result
of an extraordinary combination
1061
01:06:43,666 --> 01:06:46,793
of skill, luck, and timing
on the part of the very government
1062
01:06:46,794 --> 01:06:49,129
he allegedly detests for incompetence.
1063
01:06:49,130 --> 01:06:50,755
There are so many questions.
1064
01:06:50,756 --> 01:06:53,675
One of the most puzzling,
if he is guilty as charged,
1065
01:06:53,676 --> 01:06:55,636
what led him to do this?
1066
01:06:56,137 --> 01:07:01,725
{\an8}Everybody wanted to find out who he was,
and why he did what he did.
1067
01:07:01,726 --> 01:07:06,688
{\an8}And there was a reporter from Buffalo
named Lou Michel who got the scoop
1068
01:07:06,689 --> 01:07:10,443
{\an8}that everybody in the world was after
as they were covering the bombing.
1069
01:07:14,196 --> 01:07:15,865
While he was in prison,
1070
01:07:16,615 --> 01:07:22,079
{\an8}Dan Herbeck and I recorded
about 60 hours of conversations with him.
1071
01:07:22,830 --> 01:07:24,373
And for the most part,
1072
01:07:24,874 --> 01:07:29,420
the depth of these conversations
has never been heard by anyone before.
1073
01:07:30,421 --> 01:07:34,424
There was word that he was
an army veteran from the first Gulf War,
1074
01:07:34,425 --> 01:07:38,428
that he liked guns,
but he was really a mystery to everybody.
1075
01:07:38,429 --> 01:07:41,724
So we started with his childhood.
1076
01:07:46,812 --> 01:07:50,441
The bully theme runs so deep in his DNA
1077
01:07:51,275 --> 01:07:55,738
because he was this skinny little kid
who got picked on.
1078
01:08:09,585 --> 01:08:13,756
We can't find that he ever had
a meaningful relationship with a woman.
1079
01:08:14,256 --> 01:08:17,593
He almost fit the description
of a school shooter.
1080
01:08:18,177 --> 01:08:20,428
He had comic book collections,
1081
01:08:20,429 --> 01:08:22,889
and he wound up selling
that comic book collection
1082
01:08:22,890 --> 01:08:28,229
so that he could buy guns,
because guns made him feel secure.
1083
01:08:28,854 --> 01:08:32,607
From a really young age,
he was fascinated with guns.
1084
01:08:32,608 --> 01:08:36,861
There's a photograph of McVeigh
hanging from a tree
1085
01:08:36,862 --> 01:08:39,281
with a shoulder holster
with a pistol in it.
1086
01:08:39,782 --> 01:08:45,412
That fits into this macho type
of military guy that he's trying to be.
1087
01:08:46,372 --> 01:08:48,414
As commander in chief,
1088
01:08:48,415 --> 01:08:52,168
I can report to you,
aggression is defeated.
1089
01:08:52,169 --> 01:08:54,255
The war is over.
1090
01:08:55,464 --> 01:08:57,715
He came home from the first Gulf War.
1091
01:08:57,716 --> 01:08:59,300
He had a Bronze Star.
1092
01:08:59,301 --> 01:09:01,720
He'd killed a couple of Iraqis.
1093
01:09:02,471 --> 01:09:06,015
But even in the army, he was an outsider.
1094
01:09:16,610 --> 01:09:19,864
After the first Gulf War,
he was a lost soul.
1095
01:09:20,614 --> 01:09:22,073
Wandering around the country,
1096
01:09:22,074 --> 01:09:25,618
bouncing from Decker, Michigan,
with the Nichols brothers,
1097
01:09:25,619 --> 01:09:28,873
over to Kingman, Arizona,
to Michael Fortier.
1098
01:09:38,799 --> 01:09:42,552
As McVeigh was roaming the country,
going from gun show to gun show,
1099
01:09:42,553 --> 01:09:47,849
he was listening constantly
to these right-wing radio hosts,
1100
01:09:47,850 --> 01:09:52,771
that were peddling conspiracy theories
and spewing this anti-government rhetoric.
1101
01:09:53,272 --> 01:09:56,733
"We hate the government.
They're gonna take our guns away."
1102
01:09:56,734 --> 01:09:58,903
And McVeigh was in that fringe.
1103
01:09:59,653 --> 01:10:01,447
Dead. Right in the heart.
1104
01:10:02,364 --> 01:10:04,365
They're taking away our rights.
1105
01:10:04,366 --> 01:10:05,325
What rights?
1106
01:10:05,326 --> 01:10:06,744
Our rights for guns.
1107
01:10:07,369 --> 01:10:11,664
His anger toward the government
was just building and building.
1108
01:10:11,665 --> 01:10:15,251
So he turned to the book
that he idolized, The Turner Diaries.
1109
01:10:17,254 --> 01:10:18,838
The Turner Diaries is a book
1110
01:10:18,839 --> 01:10:21,174
that was written
by a man named William Pierce,
1111
01:10:21,175 --> 01:10:23,344
who was a longtime neo-Nazi.
1112
01:10:25,054 --> 01:10:29,015
It told the story
of a white supremacist revolutionary
1113
01:10:29,016 --> 01:10:33,812
that led an insurrection
against the federal government.
1114
01:10:36,190 --> 01:10:40,443
And it's regarded as a bible
for right-wing extremists.
1115
01:10:51,413 --> 01:10:55,125
{\an8}Probably the most important idea
expressed in The Turner Diaries
1116
01:10:55,626 --> 01:11:01,214
{\an8}is that each person has to stop being
a spectator and start being a participant.
1117
01:11:01,215 --> 01:11:02,382
In The Turner Diaries,
1118
01:11:02,383 --> 01:11:06,010
you have an illustration
of the main character
1119
01:11:06,011 --> 01:11:09,472
blowing up the FBI headquarters
with a truck bomb.
1120
01:11:09,473 --> 01:11:13,768
The truck is loaded with the same kind
of ammonium nitrate explosives
1121
01:11:13,769 --> 01:11:15,645
that McVeigh used in his bombing.
1122
01:11:15,646 --> 01:11:19,691
{\an8}Then, Waco happens in '93.
1123
01:11:19,692 --> 01:11:21,402
{\an8}Just arrived today.
1124
01:11:23,237 --> 01:11:25,530
Somebody told me
a lot of people would be scared
1125
01:11:25,531 --> 01:11:27,408
to put something on like this.
1126
01:11:29,743 --> 01:11:33,663
As many as 86 people are thought
to have died in yesterday's inferno,
1127
01:11:33,664 --> 01:11:35,581
including some 17 children.
1128
01:11:35,582 --> 01:11:37,500
There remain serious questions
1129
01:11:37,501 --> 01:11:40,253
of why the FBI
chose to go in in such force.
1130
01:11:40,254 --> 01:11:41,713
It's hard to remember
1131
01:11:41,714 --> 01:11:43,965
that all of this started
with a search warrant
1132
01:11:43,966 --> 01:11:46,676
and a cache of allegedly illegal weapons.
1133
01:11:46,677 --> 01:11:50,471
And for somebody like McVeigh,
this was absolute evidence
1134
01:11:50,472 --> 01:11:54,392
that the feds were after people like him.
1135
01:11:54,393 --> 01:11:58,521
And now he has his sense of purpose.
1136
01:12:13,412 --> 01:12:15,872
He thought that he could be the hero,
1137
01:12:15,873 --> 01:12:19,042
to alert everybody in America
that it was time
1138
01:12:19,043 --> 01:12:21,669
to take on the government
before they came for your guns.
1139
01:12:21,670 --> 01:12:25,924
The bombing, he had hoped
that that would spark a revolution.
1140
01:12:42,608 --> 01:12:45,276
The grand jury
delivered its indictment at a courthouse
1141
01:12:45,277 --> 01:12:48,488
across the street from the site
of the worst terrorist attack
1142
01:12:48,489 --> 01:12:50,198
ever in the United States.
1143
01:12:50,199 --> 01:12:51,324
The indictment alleges
1144
01:12:51,325 --> 01:12:54,535
that Timothy McVeigh
and Terry Nichols alone
1145
01:12:54,536 --> 01:12:56,496
planned and executed the bombing.
1146
01:12:56,497 --> 01:12:58,998
Also indicted today, Michael Fortier.
1147
01:12:58,999 --> 01:13:01,459
Charged with having
prior knowledge of the bombing,
1148
01:13:01,460 --> 01:13:04,462
he will testify
against McVeigh and Nichols
1149
01:13:04,463 --> 01:13:06,714
in hopes of getting a lighter sentence.
1150
01:13:06,715 --> 01:13:09,592
With what he told us,
by the time we got in the courtroom,
1151
01:13:09,593 --> 01:13:11,469
the case was really overwhelming.
1152
01:13:14,139 --> 01:13:16,891
Today, the government's star witness
against Timothy McVeigh
1153
01:13:16,892 --> 01:13:19,268
takes the stand
at the Oklahoma City bombing trial.
1154
01:13:19,269 --> 01:13:21,437
Michael Fortier is expected
to tell the jury
1155
01:13:21,438 --> 01:13:25,066
that McVeigh told him in detail
how he was going to build a bomb
1156
01:13:25,067 --> 01:13:27,402
and blow up the federal building
in Oklahoma City.
1157
01:13:27,403 --> 01:13:30,279
I really struggled with the trial.
1158
01:13:30,280 --> 01:13:32,698
I didn't want any part of the trial.
1159
01:13:32,699 --> 01:13:34,575
{\an8}I did not want to go to it.
1160
01:13:34,576 --> 01:13:37,286
{\an8}I just almost tried to pretend
it wasn't happening.
1161
01:13:37,287 --> 01:13:40,873
{\an8} In just 11 days of testimony,
the prosecution has presented
1162
01:13:40,874 --> 01:13:42,750
{\an8}more than 90 witnesses,
1163
01:13:42,751 --> 01:13:45,963
{\an8}giving McVeigh a motive
and tracing his movements.
1164
01:13:46,463 --> 01:13:49,757
Ultimately, McVeigh wanted to take
credit for the bombing
1165
01:13:49,758 --> 01:13:51,217
that he'd carried out.
1166
01:14:16,743 --> 01:14:18,203
{\an8} We, the jury,
1167
01:14:19,037 --> 01:14:21,665
find as follows in the case
of Timothy McVeigh, count one.
1168
01:14:22,458 --> 01:14:23,792
{\an8}- Conspiracy.
1169
01:14:24,418 --> 01:14:25,418
{\an8}Guilty.
1170
01:14:28,922 --> 01:14:30,841
Guilty.
1171
01:14:31,675 --> 01:14:33,218
{\an8} When the verdict was read,
1172
01:14:34,094 --> 01:14:36,596
{\an8}it was like
somebody let air out of a tire.
1173
01:14:36,597 --> 01:14:39,099
It's over. It's over.
1174
01:14:39,600 --> 01:14:44,479
Based upon these considerations,
the jury recommends, by unanimous vote,
1175
01:14:44,480 --> 01:14:46,689
that the following sentence be imposed,
1176
01:14:46,690 --> 01:14:50,568
that defendant Timothy McVeigh
will be sentenced to death.
1177
01:14:50,569 --> 01:14:52,905
Guilty.
1178
01:15:01,121 --> 01:15:04,500
I didn't want him to die
when they decided to execute him.
1179
01:15:05,459 --> 01:15:06,876
I wanted to protest.
1180
01:15:06,877 --> 01:15:09,295
{\an8} Timothy McVeigh
showed no reaction,
1181
01:15:09,296 --> 01:15:12,840
{\an8}never flinched
as he heard the jury vote for death.
1182
01:15:14,176 --> 01:15:16,511
This is not right. It's not fair.
1183
01:15:16,512 --> 01:15:20,598
He's taking the easy road out.
We have to live with this. He doesn't.
1184
01:15:49,169 --> 01:15:52,214
When I talk
about the Oklahoma Standard, it's real.
1185
01:15:56,843 --> 01:15:59,972
{\an8}Hundreds of stories of people that day
1186
01:16:00,681 --> 01:16:01,723
{\an8}that responded.
1187
01:16:02,474 --> 01:16:05,810
I just wanted to help the people,
the victims and their families.
1188
01:16:05,811 --> 01:16:07,688
They stood up for one another.
1189
01:16:10,691 --> 01:16:12,400
They looked after one another.
1190
01:16:12,401 --> 01:16:14,903
Let him know
there's still some good in the world.
1191
01:16:15,654 --> 01:16:17,197
They saved one another.
1192
01:16:20,242 --> 01:16:22,076
They prayed for each other.
1193
01:16:22,077 --> 01:16:25,080
Yeah, a prayer for people
who've lost loved ones.
1194
01:16:26,164 --> 01:16:29,792
And you think about
what that collective response means.
1195
01:16:29,793 --> 01:16:34,798
People need someone just to lean on,
someone to hold their hand, to hug them.
1196
01:16:36,008 --> 01:16:38,719
Neighbors, friends, relatives,
moms and dads.
1197
01:16:39,636 --> 01:16:40,637
Their children.
1198
01:16:45,267 --> 01:16:46,768
That's us.
1199
01:16:53,609 --> 01:16:55,776
The Oklahoma Standard
shined brightly.
1200
01:16:55,777 --> 01:16:58,238
{\an8}It shows what Oklahoma people are about.
1201
01:16:58,989 --> 01:17:00,449
{\an8}That they're caring people.
1202
01:17:27,184 --> 01:17:29,018
All this mass casualty training
I'd had,
1203
01:17:29,019 --> 01:17:32,564
never once did anyone train me
on the human factor.
1204
01:17:33,857 --> 01:17:36,151
The one thing
I didn't know going into that
1205
01:17:37,527 --> 01:17:39,404
was what it was gonna do to me.
1206
01:17:41,782 --> 01:17:44,910
That bothers me still,
and that little girl I triaged.
1207
01:17:45,535 --> 01:17:46,787
That I had to let go.
1208
01:17:48,246 --> 01:17:49,665
That really bothers me.
1209
01:18:00,008 --> 01:18:05,305
My second son, Carlos Moore Jr.,
was born on Little Tony's birthday.
1210
01:18:06,682 --> 01:18:09,851
And I was a helicopter mom
for a long time, and many years.
1211
01:18:10,352 --> 01:18:14,106
So, it's okay.
I'm okay with that.
1212
01:18:17,401 --> 01:18:20,569
He is the love of my life.
1213
01:18:20,570 --> 01:18:23,990
Yeah. He's 22 now. I can't believe it.
1214
01:18:25,242 --> 01:18:27,994
But yeah, I love him.
1215
01:18:33,041 --> 01:18:37,295
I'm very blessed
to have a second chance.
1216
01:18:40,382 --> 01:18:41,883
And I hope that it honors
1217
01:18:44,094 --> 01:18:47,138
the lives of the people
that don't have a second chance,
1218
01:18:47,139 --> 01:18:48,640
that I'm embracing mine.